So those zombies are screwed

[Old Ape Face]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhDPoVm74To&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Ecomputerforum%2E com%2F147571%2Dyoutube%2Dthread%2Ehtml&feature=player_embedded

The video tells it all, Would be kick *** if you got one of those in Left 4 Dead.

[animeotaku99]

the aa-12 really is not that great. A pump action shotgun has the versatility necassary for a combat shotgun

[Old Ape Face]

that grenade shell is impressive though, then again, I'm not in the military so my info on this stuff is really nooby.

[animeotaku99]

The Frag-12 is very nice, and would be even better utilized in a different shotgun that you can quickly insert the specialty shell into

[Old Ape Face]

I think they had another episode of a gun that looked like a monster sized version of the 50 cal, and it shot through steel like it was paper for like 500 yards away or something.

[grgspunk]

It's way too big and clunky for close quarters encounters. Not to mention if you were about to use those FRAG-12 rounds and an enemy pops up right in front of you, you'd be screwed because you wouldn't be able to quickly switch to your regular rounds, and if you do fire, you'd end up blowing up both yourself and the enemy. There's a reason why the US military chose underbarrel grenade launcher attachments over rifle grenades.

If I were a weapons manufacturer, I'd try to develop an automatic shotgun that has the compact size of a submachine gun or a carbine. Hell, I'd make it use the smaller 20 gauge round to further reduce overall recoil and increase the number of rounds per magazine. I'd leave the grenade launching job to the M203 or the Mk 19.

[Old Ape Face]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3qQB4b4Pgo&feature=related
think that's it

[Old Ape Face]

It's way too big and clunky for close quarters encounters. Not to mention if you were about to use those FRAG-12 rounds and an enemy pops up in front of you, you'd be screwed because you wouldn't be able to quickly switch to your regular rounds and if you fire, you'd end up blowing up both yourself and the enemy. There's a reason why the US military chose underbarrel grenade launchers attachments over rifle grenades.

If I were a weapons manufacturer, I'd try to develop an automatic shotgun that has the compact size of a submachine gun or a carbine. Hell, I'd make it use the smaller 20 gauge round to further reduce overall recoil and increase the number of rounds per magazine. I'd leave the grenade launching job to the M203 or the Mk 19.

I'm sure a soldier would be smart enough to use this weapon at a tactical advantage, like any fire arm that produces a splash damage effect (Video Game terminology.) you're a moron to go blasting a grenade in the open halls of closer quarters combat. With that kind of automatic fire you wouldn't need a grenade at that close.

And that tiny grenade is light weight, used in an easy to reload normal shotgun you could take that over any full sized grenade launcher.

[grgspunk]

I'm sure a soldier would be smart enough to use this weapon at a tactical advantage, like any fire arm that produces a splash damage effect (Video Game terminology.) you're a moron to go blasting a grenade in the open halls of closer quarters combat. With that kind of automatic fire you wouldn't need a grenade at that close.

This is a close quarters weapon we're talking about and anything can happen in CQB situations, even if you made sure that the coast is clear. Chances are, if you're tasked to carry that weapon along with the FRAG-12 rounds, you'll be getting up close and personal with the enemy. However, there may also be situations where you have to fire a grenade launcher from a tight position--That's why they made and issued you a shotgun-fired grenade round in the first place. For example, if I took cover in an alleyway and I needed to fire a FRAG-12 into a building via a window across from the alleyway. At the same time I'm trying to fire that thing, an enemy could be lurking and sneak up in front/behind me, no matter how many times I made sure that the area was clear to fire from: Soldiers, though well trained, aren't always perfect and surprises happen all the time. In that situation, I'd want something that will allow me to instantly switch from my grenade rounds to my regular rounds in the event of a suprise encounter--The sheer bulk of the weapon and the magazines, as well as the single-barrel configuration of the weapon, prevents me from doing so.

It'd be much better to have two barrels loaded with two different rounds (that you can instantly alternate between) as opposed to one barrel that loads both rounds. I'd much rather have an M4 equipped with an M203 as far being able to launch 'nades from a distance while maintaining an edge in close quarters.

[Gray]

Shotguns are for hunting and home defence, but other than that they're way to cumbersome. A pistol in the hands of an expert kills people just as dead with alot more versatility.

[Caster13]

DOOOOO WAAAAANNTT!*drool* Nothing besides an armored vehicle stands a chance against that thing.


And I'm sure if you have the money you can get one in Arizona somewhere.

[animeotaku99]

20 gauge is too weak to be used against a human, even when Buck shot is used.
Military just needs to stick with the Remington 870 pump action shotgun. IT can fire almost any tpye of shotgun shell from standard buck shot to door breaching rounds. and that is all a shotgun is needed for.

http://www.ammunitiontogo.com/catalog1/index.php/cPath/0_120_259_209

[animeotaku99]

DOOOOO WAAAAANNTT!*drool* Nothing besides an armored vehicle stands a chance against that thing.


And I'm sure if you have the money you can get one in Arizona somewhere.

Only the early models made and registered before 1986. In many states you just need to pay teh BATFE about $200 and some paper work BS and you can get a Class 3 weapon (pre1986 for machine guns) from a class 3 dealer.
I've considered getting a suppressor for my Walther p99 with custom threaded barrel

[grgspunk]

20 gauge is too weak to be used against a human, even when Buck shot is used.

*facepalms*

Listen, if you let me shoot you with a 20 gauge buckshot at very close range (as it's supposed to be used) and you survived, I'll let you shoot me with a 12 gauge.

[The Million Dollar Prons]

20 gauge is too weak to be used against a human, even when Buck shot is used.



The 20 is an excellent self-defense caliber, particularly for those who dislike the recoil of the 12 gauge. I recommend the 20 gauge over the more popular 12 for home defense. Choose the 20 gauge 3" shell Federal "Classic" #2 buckshot (F207-2-5PK) with 18 pellets, or the Winchester "Double XX" Magnum #3 with 24 pellets (X203C3B). If your gun cannot accept 3" shells choose the Remington #3 with 20 pellets (SP20BK5PK-3). All of these loads provide definitive short-range stopping power.

hay guy itz me prons lol

[CrossboneGundam]

This isn't new.

Also I wonder if this is Blackwater's weapon of choice for massacres of unsuspecting civilians.

Superior zombie-killing method: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93IOL_pYkp4

[Caster13]

This isn't new.

Also I wonder if this is Blackwater's weapon of choice for massacres of unsuspecting civilians.

Superior zombie-killing method: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93IOL_pYkp4


Since I can't do that, I'll take a Mega Buster.:smokin:

If somebody invented one of those I'd do ANYTHING to get that.

[Mazinkaiser]

I'd rather have a Saiga if I wanted a magazine fed shotgun (I don't). And LOL at the 20 Gauge comment, last I checked, 20 Gauge kills deer pretty well. And what kills deer usually kills people pretty well.

[SapperSix]

It's way too big and clunky for close quarters encounters. Not to mention if you were about to use those FRAG-12 rounds and an enemy pops up right in front of you, you'd be screwed because you wouldn't be able to quickly switch to your regular rounds, and if you do fire, you'd end up blowing up both yourself and the enemy. There's a reason why the US military chose underbarrel grenade launcher attachments over rifle grenades.

If I were a weapons manufacturer, I'd try to develop an automatic shotgun that has the compact size of a submachine gun or a carbine. Hell, I'd make it use the smaller 20 gauge round to further reduce overall recoil and increase the number of rounds per magazine. I'd leave the grenade launching job to the M203 or the Mk 19.


As far as I know most, if not all weapons in the US Military that fire grenades(or rockets) arm themselves at a certain distance/ number of rotations before going boom, so the developers are going to be smart enough to do the same for the FRAG-12. The 203 serves its purpose, but the rounds are big and take up a lot of room on the flak. The Mk19 is a freakin beast you'll only see mounted on vehicles or in a defensive position, and boy does it unleash hell to the enemy. Shotguns are neat and all, but the mostly serve as a breaching tool/ MP weapon, plus the shotgun is useless in a firefight with the limited rounds, and you have to load each round individually. If a Marine has a shotty, he will most likely be carrying his rifle too, he also tends to be Combat Engineer too.

[Phantom]

They just need a trusty Lobo to tackle Zombies.

[Trefellin]

Looks very unwieldy, heavy and just plain overkill.

You don't need a shotgun that fires 300 rounds per minute. That's what assault rifles and machine guns are for. It also probably goes through ammo so fast and you'd be able to carry fewer rounds than a rifleman could.

[grgspunk]

As far as I know most, if not all weapons in the US Military that fire grenades(or rockets) arm themselves at a certain distance/ number of rotations before going boom, so the developers are going to be smart enough to do the same for the FRAG-12.

That only changes the situation from either changing the magazine or blowing yourself up to changing the magazine or firing a completely ineffective round.

That still wouldn't change the fact that I'd still be screwed if I have a suprise encounter, because I'd still have to fumble around trying to change my magazines in order to have any hope of taking the guy down. The shotgun has one barrel that can only fire one type of round at a time: I can't quickly switch between my primary and grenade rounds if an enemy were to pop in front of me.

[Donto_Koi]

Superior Anti Zombie Weapons Complex:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwIITTwh1DY

[Old Ape Face]

That only changes the situation from either changing the magazine or blowing yourself up to changing the magazine or firing a completely ineffective round.

That still wouldn't change the fact that I'd still be screwed if I have a suprise encounter, because I'd still have to fumble around trying to change my magazines in order to have any hope of taking the guy down. The shotgun has one barrel that can only fire one type of round at a time: I can't quickly switch between my primary and grenade rounds if an enemy were to pop in front of me.


That's what a side arm is for, I doubt a marine is equipped with less then just a massive shotgun. The Pistol doesn't way that much and it's almost as versatile as a knife.

though that M16 dose have a bigger clip size so whatever.

[Trefellin]

though that M16 dose have a bigger clip size so whatever.

With an assault rifle, you'll have a larger magazine capacity plus you'll be able to carry more since they'll be smaller and lighter. What do they use shotguns for other than blasting locks? The guys on the ground already carry so much weight. There's no reason to burden a squad member with that clunky thing. It looks like it weighs more than twice as much as the regular pump shotguns they use.

It might be useful mounted on a humvee but they already have MGs and those grenade launcher things for that.

[Mazinkaiser]

Superior Anti Zombie Weapons Complex:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwIITTwh1DY

this. *filler*

[Old Ape Face]

Superior Anti Zombie Weapons Complex:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwIITTwh1DY

That vertical fed clip makes more sence in a shotgun or any gun (besides a pistol) than a revolving Tomigun like magazine. Since you can easily reload a new clip that is relatively lighter. It might hold less but it's still lighter.

But that same spray shot effect of the AA-12 could still be utilized.

That Saiga 12 resembles more of a board out rifle than an ordinary shotgun too.

[animeotaku99]

Well the Saiga shotguns are based off of the AK rifle design. Saiga also makes greaet AK-47/74 variants, even chambered in .308
EDIT: and it is a MAGAZINE! not aclip. a clip loads a magazine
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AF21sihEgOU&feature=related