Roy Mustang - Not enough development?

[Amuro]

What do you guys think? Did Roy not really get enough development to be a likable/noteworthy character? Did the character have more potential than was fulfilled? Should we have seen more of him? The same can be asked of characters like Hughes, Hawkeye, etc. etc.

Question is anime-specific, but the discussion extends to the manga as well.

[Talon]

He definitely did not get enough development in the anime. As for the manga. Yes, yes he did.

[bigmachini]

i haven't read the manga but i think they did a good job in teh anime

[Waga]

I think he got enough character development putting into consideration that FMA was only about 60 episodes. When you deviate from the main character too much shows can get a bit booring as proven in bleach sometimes when they decide to randomly dedicated episodes to pointless characters. Character development of the non protagonist is nice when it adds depth and flavour but I think that FMA was so well constructed as a story, and so well done, that they don't have to compulsorily develop other characters more than they already did. The themes, the plot and interpretation is so full that I didn't think it was lacking personaly.

[Tidusauron12]

I think he got enough character development putting into consideration that FMA was only about 60 episodes.

NO.

It only takes one or two episodes to develop a character well. And that doesn't have to be two straight episodes dedicated to Roy. 60 episodes was more than enough time to develop Roy... they just didn't. Cause' if they did, they'd have to develop Pinako AND Winry a bit more... and they... didn't want to do that, I guess.

[Waga]

NO.

It only takes one or two episodes to develop a character well. And that doesn't have to be two straight episodes dedicated to Roy. 60 episodes was more than enough time to develop Roy... they just didn't. Cause' if they did, they'd have to develop Pinako AND Winry a bit more... and they... didn't want to do that, I guess.


Putting into consideration the amount of side characters there were in the show I think Roy got enough characterisation. The story is mainly a core plot that revolves around the elric brothers as they travel across amestris meeting new people and having new encounters. You may not like it personaly but I think this approach works very well in FMA. There are lots of side characters that have a huge influence from the plot but given them more focus that the balanced focus the director already gave them would not be true to the approach the directors developed. If I had to give a criticism on FMA, more character development would not be at the top of my list. I can understand that it is not compulsory for directors to follow convention or increase the characterisation of semi-side characters. For the intention behind their approach, I think they handled the characterisation of the side characters quite well. As for winry she does get a bigger part in the manga as she is the main love interest of ED. In the anime Rose is the main love interest hence she gets more characterisation than Winry (and appropiately so). In the anime Winry is simply a friend and mechanic to ed.

[Tidusauron12]

Putting into consideration the amount of side characters there were in the show I think Roy got enough characterisation. The story is mainly a core plot that revolves around the elric brothers as they travel across amestris meeting new people and having new encounters. You may not like it personaly but I think this approach works very well in FMA. There are lots of side characters that have a huge influence from the plot but given them more focus that the balanced focus the director already gave them would not be true to the approach the directors developed. If I had to give a criticism on FMA, more character development would not be at the top of my list. I can understand that it is not compulsory for directors to follow convention or increase the characterisation of semi-side characters. For the intention behind their approach, I think they handled the characterisation of the side characters quite well. As for winry she does get a bigger part in the manga as she is the main love interest of ED. In the anime Rose is the main love interest hence she gets more characterisation than Winry (and appropiately so). In the anime Winry is simply a friend and mechanic to ed.


You see? What you just said right here was much more appropriate than "I think he got enough character development putting into consideration that FMA was ONLY about 60 episodes."

I don't agree with that statement, but I agree with the points you've made.

[Amuro]

There are lots of side characters that have a huge influence from the plot but given them more focus that the balanced focus the director already gave them would not be true to the approach the directors developed. [...] I can understand that it is not compulsory for directors to follow convention or increase the characterisation of semi-side characters. For the intention behind their approach, I think they handled the characterisation of the side characters quite well.

I'll entertain this notion for a moment, although I find it incorrect. I believe you're saying, whether you're aware of it or not, that the directors made the choices they did out of some abstract sense of "the way things are and should be done." While I can sympathize with your beliefs without understanding them, I must say that I absolutely loathe any such approach to anything. It's the one [and only?] thing that I agree with Ayn Rand on (sorry, impulsive reference to another thread): everything must serve a purpose.

With that said, the purpose can indeed simply be wowing people with the degree to which a person follows "the way that things are and should be done." I have, to some degree, managed to respect most of the modern Oscar-winning films simply because they're so impeccably good at following "the way that things should be done." Specifically, they imitate older movies at all the "right" moments and show off their modern technological potential in the "proper" amounts. They add the exact form of "subtlety" and "depth" that'll cause film critics to say things like "This movie succeeds in being intelligent without losing its ability to please summer audiences."

Naturally, my first thought is: "Why the heck are those two goals contradictory except out of stubborn adherence to some ridiculous prejudices with no grounding in fact?" Even, so, I can still respect the effort, the same way that I could respect the way that a person utilizes a huge amount of effort in order to translate a given book into a language that it has already been translated to (not out of the belief that he can do better, but rather out of ignorance of the fact that the book is already translated).

However, I can only "entertain" your notion, as I believe that FMA did none of these things. The lack of character development was a result of the show simply being all-around mediocre. Everything likable about the show was stolen from elsewhere, a fact that can only be unnoticed by those people who have viewed few anime or those people who are intentionally buying into the show's hype.

The directors of the show didn't have the guts to try and satisfy fan demand in order to do something with these characters. They knew that the potential that the series showed in its early episodes, and the large young boy viewing-audience, would be enough to ensure that they'd make a profit of the show. Certain other series, like the live action Sailormoon, which was underrated and underwatched in Japan but gained a following in the US, provided a good example of realizing that the viewerbase saw potential in a given character and deciding to completely take his development path off the predictable route, giving him a less cardboard role that is also more enjoyable.
(Specifically, I'm thinking of Nephrite, who started off as one of the many evil-ish henchmen and had little personality. His only memorable characteristic in the early days of the show was being massively incompetent, in typical villain fashion. As always, the audience surely saw the potential in relateability for such a character. Remarkably, the director saw this as well and allowed the character to be "abandoned" by his evil queen and to be forced to live among the regular human characters and interacting with them, doing work like sweeping floors, albeit in a blissfully incompetent manner.)

[Waga]

I disagree, A strong emphasis on the Elric brothers in FMA at the expense of others was a strength and not a weakness of FMA. Increasing the characterisation of side characters might not make the story worse but it might not neccessaraly make it better either. We comprehend, judge and experience a show or an anime series through our brain, our perception, and the way in which our emotions and mind responds to dramatic representations. A character is merely a living organism with certain traits, it's relavence in anime is that the character traits appeal to us in a certain way that is entertaining. If that is so, who is to say that increasing the number of characters whose traits are explored in depth is exponentialy more entertaining than simply exploring fewer characters in depth.

Exploring different characters is advantageous in that it allows you to explore a large range of humanity, and generates a range of different responses from the viewer which in turn entertains a viewer. However this is only one tool in a myriad of techniques by which drama can entertain. Exploring just one character, can be equally as entertaining if the character is compelling enough. Further more the themes explored in itself can give the story depth as well as act in harmony with the main character.

In FMA the Elric brothers suffer loss, feel love, and are exposed to the horors of the world, how they react to these themes increase the depth of their characterisation. These themes bring a certain intensity in the characterisation of the protagonist that grips and makes theme more compelling to the audience. In this case the side characters are interesting but are primaraly used to drive the themes and fuel the characterisation of the main characters i.e. Shou Tucker is interesting as an independent entity but is used to develop Ed's character revealing to Ed the depravity of mankind (he turns his own daughter into a chimera) and thus educating on the horors of the adult world. Ed's Initial naivety towards life, and his learning curve and reaction towards harsh reality are all integral to his characterisation, giving it a range depth and intensity that is very enjoyable to watch as an audience.

When Applying a Socratic approach you have to ask what characterisation is. It is simply the portrayal of 'character'. Adding more characterisation to a show does not always equal good television, the same way adding as extra wheel to a bicycle does not neccessaraly make it more efficient. Characterisation is simply a feature of dramatic representation that is there to be used as seen fit. Increasing the depth of Characterisation does not neccessaraly increase the depth of a dramatic presentation. For example if a film focuses on a main character the character, can be so intense and engaging that simply adding extra characters or developing side characters would do nothing to improve that film. Then again developing side characters might add a new angle to the plot and create a refreshing change. It all depends on the way the story is constructed. I think that FMA is consructed in a way that the is an intense focus on the protagonist and his exploration of humanity is a perfect combination.

Entertainment, and compelling drama can be generated by various means and combinations. The intense Characterisation of a protagonist at the expense of side characters and Vice Versa are both ways in which compelling drama can be generated. At the end of the day both equate to characterisation. It is how a director interprets the characterisation and interweaves it with the plot and themes, that makes the difference.

It is dangerous to spew out cliche's just because it is cliched. Just because something sounds right doesn't mean it is.

[Amuro]

I understand where you're coming from now. I didn't find the Elric brothers too interesting, but that may just be my prejudice against "young kid main characters" (as a result of having seen too many such characters and not having particularly noticed any way in which the Elric brothers added to this character-type).

At the same time, the series spent a significant amount of time on action sequences and filler-ish stories. This is time that I feel they could have used for character development, even if it was development for the Elric brothers and not for a side-character like Roy. I know that I personally felt nothing for the brothers and wasn't intrigued by their development path. I don't feel that the creators showed a dedication towards developing their characters, and I really don't believe that any members of the audience wanted the plentiful action sequences, although I might just be being narrow-minded.

[Waga]

I can also see where you're coming from. I personaly enjoyed these 'fillers' because it took a breather from the intensity of the show to focus on a lighter aspect of life. But thats probably just my personal opinion.

[CitizenGeek]

Nah, I think Roy Mustang was appropriately developed. He's not a main character, and we do get a deep insight into his past, and his relationships with other characters. I think he was a great character as he was, to be honest - never thought he was underdeveloped.

On the issue of underdeveloped characters, I think FMA would have been better if the homunculi had more screen time! 8D

[psyche69]

Nah, I think Roy Mustang was appropriately developed. He's not a main character, and we do get a deep insight into his past, and his relationships with other characters. I think he was a great character as he was, to be honest - never thought he was underdeveloped.

On the issue of underdeveloped characters, I think FMA would have been better if the homunculi had more screen time! 8D

Right I think that too...for me his character was developed because it is given a time to know his past and other issue regarding him and the other character too...probably because he is not the main character and he is not also the main villain so is not main focus of the story....

[Gyt Kaliba]

He was developed enough for you to know where he was coming from and his real purpose behind it all, so what's the problem? There are far less-developed characters in the show than Mustang.

[Westlo]

I don't feel that the creators showed a dedication towards developing their characters, and I really don't believe that any members of the audience wanted the plentiful action sequences, although I might just be being narrow-minded.

It's based on a Shounen manga not a Shoujo manga of course the audience wanted action sequences.

[crow-kun]

It's based on a Shounen manga not a Shoujo manga of course the audience wanted action sequences.The hell is that supposed to mean? The manga has a **** ton of character development for Roy.:mad:

[TheRabbit]

The hell is that supposed to mean? The manga has a **** ton of character development for Roy.:mad:

I think that is exactly the point. In a manga, an action sequence can be expressed in a few frames (depending on what is actually happening) meaning that you can fit character exposition in without seeming boring. In anime, the action sequences take longer to complete to any decent extent, and it is, quite honestly, easier to get bored during a long bit of character exposition.

[Waga]

^True
I think overall the anime is well balanced but this is not through actively trying to seek balance for the sake of it. Instead the director interpreted the manga brillinatly for the anime, and quality inevitably showed in all departments. And thats one of the many reasos why if ever there was such a thing as the Greatest Ever Anime, It would probably be FullMetal Alchemist.

[Yozuki]

Mustang's subordinates could have definitely used some more developement, but they were also secondary characters. Mustang reminds me of a few people I know, and Mustang even states it himself, he wanted to be in control, and he has the personality to match. He doesn't develop so much in personality as he does for his relations with other characters.

[KakuTheGiraffe]

Compared to the manga, every character with exeption of the Elric Brothers, Hoenheim, and Envy was underdeveloped