Official Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Thread *SPOILERS*

[Josh]

Please use this thread to discuss Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows. This thread will contain SPOILERS, stop now if you want to avoid them!

[Sushikins]

Just finished the 7th Book at around 8am this morning. Great Stuff, and my favorite entry in the entire series. I'm more than a little sad it's all over now, though.

[max payne]

Got Deathly Hallows last night at midnight. It is awesome. More than awesome, actually.

[Holy Knight]

Currently about 150 pages into it. So far, it lives up to Harry Potter's name and is among the better books I've read in the series. I'll post a review once I finish it.

[Caine]

I'm waiting to post anything until Kevin gives the OK, though I have finished.

[Alice Catherine]

I got it at 9 and finished at 3:30 today. But I'll be careful not to post anything else.

[Lord Timaeus]

I already know everything, so I'm in no rush to read it. Though part of me wishes I could have been at Barnes and Noble last night to spoil the book for the rest of them.

[StandingAlone]

Hey, just wondering. If you have read the Deathly Hollows, is it a good book? I want to read it but I am kind of hesitant. I don't really want to spend my money on something I think is just ok or sucks. Just drop in your two cents, thanks.

[max payne]

Man, this whole "I'm so cool, I want to spoil the last book" malarky is getting stale. Beyond stale. It's not like anyone will do it, even if they do it'll just get locked and deleted.

I'm just over half way through now, it's great so far. Might be my favorite book so far.

[goddessofanime]

Got it today at Wal Mart and I'll up to Chapter 3. I will shoot a Quincy arrow if anyone spoils it for me!

[Nano]

I waited at the shop for my copy......am I okay to say that Kevin?

It was a great book, the best of them all. And I made a shocking prediction that came true, I made it weeks before hand so I was very pleased with myself.
I'm sorry, but Harry steps on a snail and kills it=(

[Dorktron2000]

I got it at 9 and finished at 3:30 today. But I'll be careful not to post anything else.

You make me feel like such a slow reader it took me from 9 to 8 with an hour break to listen to some baseball.

[Bezerker]

I just got done with the book, I've gotta say it left me disappointed. The final battle seemed somewhat anti-climactic. I actually preferred one of the fake ending spoilers involving an epilogue of Draco in the process of creating horcruxes. Now that would be a good ending (one that leaves you hanging and begging for more).

Alas, it was a great series, hopefully the HBP & DH movies will do justice. I'm actually looking forward to the DH movie just for the battle scenes alone.

[Nano]

The action is why I'm looking forward to the film, it's just full of it. I think Draco is too lame to be making any of those horcruxes, it would just leave me thinking who the hell wrote that ending because it wasn't JK rowling.

[KatayokuのTenshi]

I just got done with the book, I've gotta say it left me disappointed. The final battle seemed somewhat anti-climactic.

I sort of felt that way too, until I thought about it more and everything just sort of clicked.
The action is why I'm looking forward to the film, it's just full of it. I think Draco is too lame to be making any of those horcruxes, it would just leave me thinking who the hell wrote that ending because it wasn't JK rowling.
It would be quite out of character wouldn't it? At this point I really want to discuss a spoiler :(
Im still here? how anticlimactic
Why read a book just to spoil it for others?

[tsuki no miko]

I just read all of book 7 and I'd say it was pretty fun, not to mention sad memories and pasts too.

There are a bit of plot holes but overall it was worth reading! :)

[Elysial]

I finished book 7. Oh, Deathly Hallows, you were doing so well, until you got to that ending and that horrible epilogue...otherwise great book.

[Alice Catherine]

I didn't like beginning though, so maybe I just skimmed over it or something. I like reading fast.

[Nano]

The beginning kicks ***!
Right away things start heating up and Dudley is nice!

[Holy Knight]

Finally finished the book and I deem it the best in the series.

Starts out strong, drags a little toward the middle, but keeps pounding the pace for the last 150 pages or so. I thought the ending was perfect, too. Couldn't have been any other way, knowing the series. The author made an excellent job of tying everything together in a very plausible fashion.

I also found the character development, though predictable, very enjoyable to read. As I believe I've seen another member say so a while ago, J.K. Rowling writes crack. Her writing style is very addictive. Many far superior works of literature have failed to keep me riveted this closely to a book for quite a while.

In short, an excellent end to an excellent series. The author deserves her fame.

[Kevin]

The ban on posting Deathly Hallows is lifted, but, as always, use spoiler tags when posting them or that will get you in trouble.

[Alice Catherine]

Spanks for lifting the Potter Rule, Kevin.

Now I can rant.

I am talking, of course, about Chapter 33.
While it was not only the most well-written chapter in the book, places itself within the top ten chapters of the series, and was plenty emotional, I STILL find the SnapexLily relationship unrealistic. I mean, I find his heartbreak plenty realistic, because it's happened to me. But I do feel that if he truly loved her, he would have renounced his stand on Muggles and Muggle-born witches and wizards much sooner than he did. Also, we never really got any evidence that James grew up. What made him so different from Sirius in that he cursed Snape every opportunity? My respect for Lily went down like a billion points after reading the chapter.
Also I ship SnapexBellatrix, so yeah.

[Nano]

Spanks for lifting the Potter Rule, Kevin.

Now I can rant.

I am talking, of course, about Chapter 33.
While it was not only the most well-written chapter in the book, places itself within the top ten chapters of the series, and was plenty emotional, I STILL find the SnapexLily relationship unrealistic. I mean, I find his heartbreak plenty realistic, because it's happened to me. But I do feel that if he truly loved her, he would have renounced his stand on Muggles and Muggle-born witches and wizards much sooner than he did. Also, we never really got any evidence that James grew up. What made him so different from Sirius in that he cursed Snape every opportunity? My respect for Lily went down like a billion points after reading the chapter.
Also I ship SnapexBellatrix, so yeah.


You're dumb! But you already knew that.

[Holy Knight]

Ban's up, eh? Then I have my bit.

On Voldemort:

The way he dismisses "Love" is too...human to come out of him. If he had evidently severed his soul in seven and rendered himself not-human, then wouldn't he be as much uncapable of liking love as much as disliking it? Casting it asside as such would make it a decidedly human reaction and not one that was carefully considered by one who has gone quite far in order to attaint immortality. It should have been easy for him to view "Love" as a standalone emotion that would have caried substantial possibilities towards mistakes he may have made or facts he may have disregarded and not as to something to be "felt", then he may have succeded. As it is, I find it unreal that he discards it so readily after becoming less (or more, depends on your point of view) than a human.

Then again, this question is probably too much for a series like Harry Potter to answer. Just a peeve of mine, I guess. It's a quirk that comes with being the Dark Lord, I suppose.

@Alice:

While I agree Snape x Lily is a bit shaky, it does give quite a turn on Snape's character and no other woman in the series would have been fit, given the circumstances. It was very well put, as you said. However, I see it as fitting.

As for his stance, we can simply say that he considered Lily special and appart from other Muggles, but that at the time he was still undecided in his allegiances. The wizarding world was stirring with anti-muggle thoughts, anyway, so he thought it would be against his community to renounce his ways.

And Bellatrix with Snape would have made one of the worst pairings any bit of slash fanfiction could cook up. But maybe that's just me.

And lastly:

I said before that I considered Snape to be awesome. He is now an immortal character of the series.

[hiei_kurama27]

I've had the book since Saturday morning and I'm only up to page 330. Slow reading makes for more understanding, I couldn't stand finishing a book like this in a single day or less. If I did that I'd miss a lot of key points.

I love this book so far. A bunch of things have surprised me.

[Nano]

MAJOR ENDING SPOILER!!!!
You know when Harry is hit by the killing curse near the ending of the book but he survives it? I predicted that to happen.

[Alice Catherine]

You're dumb! But you already knew that.

How is that right?

@Holy Knight: Meh, I just think that we need more history on James before I believe truly in LilyxSnape. Oh, and btw Snape is a God.

[Dorktron2000]

I am talking, of course, about Chapter 33.
While it was not only the most well-written chapter in the book, places itself within the top ten chapters of the series, and was plenty emotional, I STILL find the SnapexLily relationship unrealistic. I mean, I find his heartbreak plenty realistic, because it's happened to me. But I do feel that if he truly loved her, he would have renounced his stand on Muggles and Muggle-born witches and wizards much sooner than he did.

It's called being a hypocrite. Lots of people are hypocrites; one example, Strom Thurmond, a man who once spoke for 24 hours straight to stop civil rights legislation, had an affair, resulting in a kid, with a black woman.

Also, the parts you skipped at the beginning had some of the best character development in the series. Kind of plodding, but still very nice.

[goddessofanime]

Finished it today. Some thoughts:

Totally knew that Snape would go. It was pretty much written that way in Book 6. And I like Snape X Lily.

Bellatrix is one nasty piece of work.

Thought Draco would go, but he didn't.

The Epilogue was cute, but predictable: Potters: The Next Generation!

[Lord Timaeus]

First of all, if there's ever going to be a sequel or spinoff regarding the kids in the epilogue, somebody please Obliviate everyone responsible for such tripe. That truly was the Epilogue That Shouldn't Have Been.

Second, as one of the biggest fans of the Weasley twins, I was sad to see their horrible fate. I understand this is war, but leaving virtually the only comic relief of the series for dead is just too much.

Third, I was a little disappointed with how Voldemort died. Considering his power and status as the Dark Lord, he went down way too easily. I guess I expected more from such a powerful villain.

Other than that, this book is quite an improvement over the previous two.

[Alice Catherine]

It's called being a hypocrite. Lots of people are hypocrites; one example, Strom Thurmond, a man who once spoke for 24 hours straight to stop civil rights legislation, had an affair, resulting in a kid, with a black woman.

Also, the parts you skipped at the beginning had some of the best character development in the series. Kind of plodding, but still very nice.

Hypocrites suck.

EDIT @ LT: Agreed. With the entire post but the first and last sentence.

[superplough]

Prepare for an extremely long rant.

I agree with everything you say LT except that it is an improvement over the last two. While I didn't like OotP as much as the first four, I thought HBP was a really good read, and actually kept me interested. The only reason I kept reading DH was to find out what happened.
I nearly put it down when Hedwig died. I mean come on. HEDWIG? ORLY? She killed the freaking OWL for crying out loud.
Every death in the book other than Dobby's was lame and seemed forced, to use Alice's words. Moody's was only put in for filler. (BTW, did Mundungus die? He was with Moody wasn't he?)

Fred's was just plain BAD. Seriously. The room exploded and he got smooshed.

Crabbe... where do I start... he was completely out of character. He's never so much as talked before, and now he can use curses as powerful as Fiendfyre? Which in itself was just deus ex machina to destroy the diadem.

Lupin/Tonks/Creevy: Offscreen. Enough said.

Bellatrix: OMFG. "NOT MY DAUGHTER, YOU *****!" Was JKR channeling 4chan when she wrote this?

Harry: The whole 'Harry is a horcrux' was so predictable. My 12 year old (at the time) brother predicted it on his own immediately after reading HBP. And what was with the Matrix-esque scene in the train station. Freaking weird.

Voldemort: Rebounded Avada Kedavra? It's been done, Rowling. That was seriously lame. In fact, the whole idea of the Deathly Hallows was lame. If Voldemort had the Resurrection Stone, I find it impossible to believe he would not have found out what it was and how to use it. As for the Elder Wand, I can handle Draco getting the control of it by Disarming Dumbledore in the tower, but when Harry Disarmed Draco, Draco only had his regular wand. He shouldn't have gained control. And HOW IN THE HECK was Dumbledore supposed to have defeated Grindelwald when he had the most powerful freaking wand in existence???

Speaking of Grindelwald. Why was he even in it. I'm damn sure JKR said in an interview that he was insignificant and long gone. That was extremely lame.

And the other Hallow, Harry's Invisibility Cloak. If it's supposed to be so great, then how come Moody's eye could see through it in GoF? And it shouldn't have been able to expose Harry's head in PoA.

'The Trace'. What. JKR specifically explained in one or more books that while the Ministry could detect magic, they couldn't identify the source of the magic, thus it is up to the parents of underage wizards to make sure they obey the law. Then she threw all that out the window with this Trace business.

The scene in the Ministry, the scene in Gringotts, and the scene at Malfoy Manor were all horrible. Umbridge was pathetic compared to her former self, and didn't get any comeuppance at all.
JKR: [Laughter] Awww. Well, Umbridge, she’s a pretty evil character.
MA: She's still out and about in the world?
JKR: She's still at the Ministry.
MA: Are we going to see more of her? [Jo nods.] You say that with an evil nod.
JKR: Yeah, it's too much fun to torture her not to have another little bit more before I finish.
Didn't happen.

The Malfoys.. okay, so we got a little bit from Lucius that he cared about his son, but next to nothing from Draco. He really needed a great wrap-up scene, he needed SOMETHING. I don't even know what happened to him at the end.

Neville/Luna/Ginny: Neither of them was in it enough. All three are powerful wizards/witches, but only had a tiny role. Especially Neville. He should have had a powerful scene involving Bellatrix (which would have been far better than that "NOT MY DAUGHTER YOU *****" crap.

Dumbledore. Oh dear lord, Dumbledore. I don't even know what to say about this. I think Alice had it right in a PM she sent me: he's an *******. I also agree with Alice on what she said about James.

Snape.. wasn't done too badly. I didn't like the fact that it was a bunch of pensieve memories strung together, but it was alright. He, for me, was the most interesting character, and still is. His death was absolutely lame though. Oooh SNAKES ON A SNAPE!

The Weasleys.. they didn't really do anything. Bill could have been involved in the Gringotts scene, or they could have met Charlie after that ridiculous dragon escape. I've already said about Fred Molly and Ginny. I can't remember if Arthur or George did anything or not. As for Ron, emo much? I suppose he was ok. Especially compared to his family.

Hermione was weird. She had one plot hole, in that she said that she'd modified her parents' memories and sent them to Australia, then later saying she'd never done one before. Also, in 2004, JKR told us her middle name was 'Jane'; however she changed it to 'Jean' in Book 7. Hermione and Harry also both seem to be ok with using Unforgivable Curses left right and center.

It also would have been nice to have some Greyback/Lupin action, and to get answers for whatever's going on in the Department of Mysteries (like the Veil that Sirius fell through).

I'm sure I'll think of more to rant about later.

[KatayokuのTenshi]

^ For the moment I'll just say two things

1 When was the spoiler ban lifted?
2 Most of the things you asked were answered in the book you know.

[superplough]

1 When was the spoiler ban lifted?
The ban on posting Deathly Hallows is lifted, but, as always, use spoiler tags when posting them or that will get you in trouble.

Then.

2 Most of the things you asked were answered in the book you know.

Really? Which ones and where? Sorry, I must not have picked them up..

[KatayokuのTenshi]

Well I may have exaggerated when I said most ... but several:


I can't use normal quotes because they evade spoiler tags -_-;

"Voldemort: Rebounded Avada Kedavra? It's been done, Rowling. That was seriously lame."

Not rebounded per se. Harry had defeated the master of the Elder Wand and so became it's master, Harry wanted Voldemort to kill him to get that piece of soul. Because of this Voldemort never defeated Harry. For this reason Snape didn't become it's master when he killed Dumbledor because it was Dumbledore’s intention to die. He killed him but he didn't 'defeat' him. Most of the Wizards through out time have assumed that killing is the way forward. Grindelwald proved that this wasn't necessary when he obtained it as a youth, by theft. The owner was 'defeated' but not killed.

The Elder Wand wasn't Vodemort's to use so when he used it on Harry and he didn't wish to die it destroyed Voldemort.
"In fact, the whole idea of the Deathly Hallows was lame. If Voldemort had the Resurrection Stone, I find it impossible to believe he would not have found out what it was and how to use it."
He is extremely arrogant, much like the eldest Perverell (sp) brother. This has been the one factor that has caused him to make mistake after mistake throughout the series, until the weight of all those bad decisions crushed him. -_-; He even assumed that the Room of Requirement was his alone even though it was full of crap when he got there.

"As for the Elder Wand, I can handle Draco getting the control of it by Disarming Dumbledore in the tower, but when Harry Disarmed Draco, Draco only had his regular wand. He shouldn't have gained control. And HOW IN THE HECK was Dumbledore supposed to have defeated Grindelwald when he had the most powerful freaking wand in existence???"
Well like I said above the Wand passes over when the user is considered defeated by the wands own standards, what ever they may be. Defeating the user not the Wand is the key I believe. The first user lost it because his throat was cut while he slept not in a duel.
Grindelwald is a little more difficult, Rita Skita's book suggested that he 'Conjured a White flag from his wand as Dumbledore approached' or something. There may be something in that... it's possible that Grindelwald refused to fight Dumbledore, either out of friendship or fear, I imagine he was smart enough to suspect that, unlike the fairy tale, the wand is not infallible (as Dumbledore said), and knowing that Dumbledore was the more powerful he surrendered... or the wand abandoned him when he lost heart (although that's a stretch)

"And the other Hallow, Harry's Invisibility Cloak. If it's supposed to be so great, then how come Moody's eye could see through it in GoF? And it shouldn't have been able to expose Harry's head in PoA."

As with the others it's powerful but not perfect (the stone doesn’t even resurrect the dead really) all that was said was that it can't be enchanted nor can the magic wear off like a normal invisibility cloak. The Death Eater was unable to summon it, but it doesn’t render the user impervious to magic... you could be stunned under it for example. Moody's eye sees through things, why would it bypass one solid object and not another. In a way Moody's eye could be said to work on the person not the cloak ... or something (another stretch) And it exposed his head because it slipped when it was stood on, it may be magic proof but it isn't idiot proof.

"JKR: [Laughter] Awww. Well, Umbridge, she’s a pretty evil character.
MA: She's still out and about in the world?
JKR: She's still at the Ministry.
MA: Are we going to see more of her? [Jo nods.] You say that with an evil nod.
JKR: Yeah, it's too much fun to torture her not to have another little bit more before I finish.

Didn't happen."

Well she was in it ... or did you mean no comeuppance? Well she lost the thing she was using to prove she was pure blooded, lost all of the prisoners under her 'care' had her office broken into ... yeah she's keeping her job :P not to mention she was stuck in a room of Dementors! O_O

"The Malfoys.. okay, so we got a little bit from Lucius that he cared about his son, but next to nothing from Draco. He really needed a great wrap-up scene, he needed SOMETHING. I don't even know what happened to him at the end."

Yeah Draco kind of reverts to type doesn’t he? He never wanted to be 'bad', and as soon as possible he went back to simply being 'coward' it could have been handled better... although I like the line about the Malfoy's huddled in the corner of the hall unsure if they were allowed to be there.

"Neville/Luna/Ginny: Neither of them was in it enough. All three are powerful wizards/witches, but only had a tiny role. Especially Neville. He should have had a powerful scene involving Bellatrix (which would have been far better than that "NOT MY DAUGHTER YOU *****" crap."

Neville was running Dumbledore’s Army, he killed Nagini ... one step removed from killing Voldemort himself. That's quite an accomplishment for someone that couldn't even levitate a feather in the first book. Luna ... seemed a bit plot device-ish TBH. Ginny was fighting through out the book, just most of it was off screen... like stealing Griffendor's sword ... though that proved pointless. She seemed to be a bit of a foil/motivation for Harry: 'Let's all save the world so we can go and be happily ever after' sort of thing.

"Hermione was weird. She had one plot hole, in that she said that she'd modified her parents' memories and sent them to Australia, then later saying she'd never done one before. Also, in 2004, JKR told us her middle name was 'Jane'; however she changed it to 'Jean' in Book 7. Hermione and Harry also both seem to be ok with using Unforgivable Curses left right and center. "

Now that's hard to get around ... unless of course she confounded her parents and then told them everything she wanted them to know. Dumbledore confounded Dawlish twice and look at how messed up he ended. There are a number of charms that effect memory, but the only one that is called a Memory Charm is the one that is encanted: Oblivate (sp)

As for the unforgivables, they were allowed when apprehending Death Eaters during the first war, I'm assuming they are applying the same logic.


"Snape.. wasn't done too badly. I didn't like the fact that it was a bunch of pensieve memories strung together, but it was alright. He, for me, was the most interesting character, and still is. His death was absolutely lame though. Oooh SNAKES ON A SNAPE!"

I AM FED UP OF THE G***** SNAKES ON THIS G***** SNAPE! MOT****** ********** etc :P
He was the bravest character of them all. That's all I'll say.

" I also agree with Alice on what she said about James."

Remember all we know about James comes from Snape ... everyone else thinks he was great ... it's possible that he was only like that towards Snape ... cos let's face it he seems a bit evil at first... And Lily only went out with him in the 7th year. I'm assuming he mellowed somewhat (you know stopped being an arse) but the damage was already done from Snape's POV.

"(like the Veil that Sirius fell through)."

Based on what it did I assume it was used for executions. Either before they had control of the Dementors or while they were fighting for Voldemort.

"(BTW, did Mundungus die? He was with Moody wasn't he?) "

No he ran off as soon as the fight started.. Harry had Kreacher go get him to find the locket remember ("Shall I hit him once more master? For luck?" "No ..we need him conscious")

Remember J.K.R is a master of Chekhov’s Gun, if anything is important chances are that it's been there all along.

[superplough]

You're probably right about Hermione confunding her parents. I never thought of that. And I definitely agree with Snape being the bravest character. I just didn't like his death.

You're also right about Voldemort being too arrogant and forgetting things, but he just seems to do it to a much bigger extent in this book.

What Neville there was WAS cool, I just didn't think there was enough. And having Ginny offscreen was lame. I think that if JKR was going to make them get together she should have actually had a scene of it, not just implying it in the epilogue.

Thanks for reminding me of Mundungus too.

Kreacher I thought was plain awesome, one of the only things I actually really liked in the book.

Heh, I suppose I did heatedly rant a bit without thinking of some things.. thanks. ^_^

[Caine]

thank you Kevin, now the ranting shall commence

On Snape
I thought that whole SnapexLily initially came off as touching, then got pretty creepy. I was surprised by how long he styed undercover though, I thought that it would be more in character for him to turn for the battle, though I guess staying in cahracter until the end fit him.
On the Deathly Hallows
WTF^^?
Are we in an RPG all of a sudden? The powerful artifact thing seems out of place in this world. Also, none of the Deathly Hallows were that impressive. A perfect invisibility cloak that can be seen through? A ring that let's you talk to the dead might be redeemable, but a wand whose holder can't be defeated that only can be possessed by the one who defeated its previous owner doesn't make sense in the Potter world.
On Voldemort
His death actually didn't bother me that much, except the whole deathstick thing, and I think its because of who Harry was. If Voldemort was supposed to lose to a more powerful wizard, it would have had to have been Dumbledore who killed him. If he were to die for his evil, it would probably have had to have been Wormtail or Lucius. If he was simply to be outmaneuvered it could have been Snape, and of ot was because he was alone, it would have had to have been a coalition that killed him (probably involving Kreacher (dobby had he lived) Griphook, Firenze (or bane) plus a witch and a wizard, at bare minimum. None of those were the reasons he lost, he lost because of love, and the biblical tie-ins with Harry were just too plentiful her way (live by the sword, love hath no greater...lay down one's life for one's friends, John 3:16 all come to mind.) which brings us to...
Jesus
Its no CS Lewis, but the tale had its share of Biblical influence. Of course, Jesus wasn't nearly that emo
Emo
nothing pissed me off as much as Harry's little emo kick where he wanted to be a martyr so much he threw away his friends. I would have like to see the DA do a bit more, to tell the truth.
Neville
Finally, this kid becomes a hero. It was more satisfying than it should have been. I appreciated the symbolism of the sword, but does a wizard really need a sword? I mean c'mon, you have magic for chris'sake!
The Deaths
I thought she should have done something mroe with the PM's death, since he wasn't evil.
Lupin, Tonks, and Creevey were off screen.
Mad Eye seemed odd, I had him pegged as the best survivor. though it makes sense, in hindsight, since he also was the one who would shoulder the greatest burden and the greatest risk.
Dobby was the one that hit me the hardest.
The Bellatrix thing was odd. She can take on three at once, but not one middle aged woman? And yeah, Neville should have gotten his shot at her. Neville sidenote, i thoguht that gran should have been a character, and then she should have taken on Bellatrix. That would have made the most sense to me.
Draco
Some have pointed out that the whole wand/broomstick thing seems a bit queer. I find myelf forced to agree.
on stupid little things
I agree with the questions about the trace.
Wouldn't the ultimate sign of resistance be not using the ame Voldmemort, but the name Riddle? harry does use this at the end, but I would have though it would have made sense as an act of defiance earlier than that.
I didn't understand why Snape couldn't tell the Death Eaters about Grimmauld place. They seemed to know something was there, so why wouldn't they ask him? All he had to do was write it down.
[/rant]

I'm sure I'll have more later.

@ HK
I'm not sure I understand why Voldemort would be incapabler of having contempt for love as a magic, which is how I percieved what he had. I think he had that contempt before he ever tore his soul (if he didn't. he never could have torn his soul, perhaps never even ventured down the road of the dark arts)

[superplough]

I forgot about Wormtail! Now that was pretty lame in itself. He owed Harry his life, so he strangles himself. Riiiiight.

Yeah, it would have been pretty cool for Neville's grandma to be in it.

[KatayokuのTenshi]

^ The hand stangled him, it was Voldemort's creation, I guess it had an anti chicken out device installed.

"On the Deathly Hallows
WTF^^?
Are we in an RPG all of a sudden? The powerful artifact thing seems out of place in this world."

It's a .44 Chekhov’s Gun, the most powerful plot device in the world, it'll blow your hed clean off from three acts ago ... they may also be a MacGuffin
One man says, 'What's that package up there in the baggage rack?' And the other answers, 'Oh that's a McGuffin.' The first one asks 'What's a McGuffin?' 'Well' the other man says, 'It's an apparatus for trapping lions in the Scottish Highlands.' The first man says, 'But there are no lions in the Scottish Highlands,' and the other one answers 'Well, then that's no McGuffin!'
-_-;

[Caine]

^^

he didn't strangle himself, his magical artificial arm, which voldemort had created, and thus presumably controlled to some degree, killed him

^ WTF^^

[KatayokuのTenshi]

Chekhov's Gun is the literary technique whereby an element is introduced early in the story, but whose significance does not become clear until later on. For example, a character may find a mysterious object that eventually becomes crucial to the plot, but at the time of finding the object does not seem to be important. In all cases, the introduced element is so conspicuous that it raises unanswered questions for the reader or audience. These questions are then answered as the story continues.

The history of devices supplied to the Hero in a classic quest, by beings who seem to have some foreknowledge of what will be needed in the quest, is very old. For example, when Perseus sets out to kill Medusa, Athena and Hermes first supply him with winged sandals, a cap of invisibility, a sickle for removing heads, and a mirrored shield. He needs them all.

An example can be found in the twin pistols of the title character in Henrik Ibsen's play Hedda Gabler, which make an appearance in the first act, but are not used to important effect until the last act.

As the man himself said: "One must not put a loaded rifle on the stage if no one is thinking of firing it."

Alfred Hitchcock:
"We have a name in the studio, and we call it the 'MacGuffin.' It is the mechanical element that usually crops up in any story. In crook stories it is most always the necklace and in spy stories it is most always the papers."

The element that distinguishes a MacGuffin from other types of plot devices is that it is not important what the object specifically is. Anything that serves as a motivation will do. The MacGuffin might even be ambiguous. Its importance is accepted by the story's characters, but it does not actually have any effect on the story. It can be generic or left open to interpretation.

The MacGuffin is common in films, especially thrillers. Commonly, though not always, it is the central focus of the film in the first act, and later declines in importance as the struggles and motivations of characters play out. Sometimes the MacGuffin is all but forgotten by the end of the film.

Grindelwald anyoen? That is a more tenous comparison than the Chekhov's Gun analagy though.

[Nano]

General points on the film.
the wand can go to the person who KILLED it's owner, it doesn't have to be a defeat through a dual. Voldemort didn't realize about the ring because he had no such use for an item, so not once did he miss a dead person or wish someone was alive when he was holding the ring, other wise the dead person would have appeared. Calling him riddle from the begininng would have been dumb because everyone would ask "Who the hell is Tom Riddle?" And he would have had to explain to every person who asked.

[Kevin]

I rather enjoyed the book, and I felt the ending was justified and deserved.

[Alice Catherine]

I lol'd at Grindelwald, by the way. So random.

Yes, in the book, she says that "James grew up."

But where's the cold hard PROOF? I mean, everyone saw him as a God. Everyone except Snape. He was STILL a complete asshat to Snape. So I think James is like Tom Riddle in that he can charm the right people. Who else could go to Head Boy without even being Prefect?

Xeno Lovegood plotline was meh, too.

[KatayokuのTenshi]

Proof? Of what? That James Grew up? Perhaps the fact that Lily (who had no patience for his idiocys) fell in love with him. And no he and Voldemort are different, in that Voldemort has proven himself entirely incapable of change ... or rational thought it seems.

RE: The Epilogue, Rowling says that it was originally much more detailed, but wanted it to read more like ...writing and less like a list.

Interview: WITH SPOILERS (http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/19959323/)

[RPGQueen]

Good book. Best in the series.
Cried when Snape died. I really liked Snape. I don't think that the relationship between him and Lily is that far stretched. I think that he was man enough to see that it was his own fault Lily went to James. poor guy.

[Caine]

General points on the film.
the wand can go to the person who KILLED it's owner, it doesn't have to be a defeat through a dual. Voldemort didn't realize about the ring because he had no such use for an item, so not once did he miss a dead person or wish someone was alive when he was holding the ring, other wise the dead person would have appeared. Calling him riddle from the begininng would have been dumb because everyone would ask "Who the hell is Tom Riddle?" And he would have had to explain to every person who asked.



The wand went to whoever defeated its previous owner. That defeat could take many forms, not just killing, but if the wand made its owner truly unbeatable, a battle of magic should be the one way in which it can't be passed on, since the owner would never lose. The wand should only be able to be passed on through treachery or ignorance.
As for calling Voldemort Riddle, Harry was talking to a very few people, most of whom knew that name.


should we still bother using spoilers, since it seems like every post is mostly spoilered anyway??

[tsuki no miko]

I totally loved the last book!!
Was near tears at the ending :crybaby:

Especially the chapter, "The Princes Tale"!! I was really holding back tears!! When Snape says "Look..at..me..." (he obviously wanted to see Lily Evan's eyes for the last time! *sob* and when Harry knealt down and addressed his second son, Albus Severus Potter!!
When you go back to the previous books you can now see heavy hints on the Sev/Lily relationship. Like in the first book when Snape first asks Harry what he would get if he added Asphodel and wormwood! Both plants hold the meanings of bitter remorse and regret. Asphodel is from the family of lily's. AND Snape said that these two combined make a draght of "living death" which sums up what Snape's life was basically like after he lost Lily. The element of unrequited love really did spice up the ending!

[KatayokuのTenshi]

^ I think that's a bit of a stretch :unsure: ... I assumed that particular potion was ment to sound impressive, Snape following up on his promise to teach the students to 'Put a stopper in death'

[tsuki no miko]

^ I think that's a bit of a stretch :unsure: ... I assumed that particular potion was ment to sound impressive, Snape following up on his promise to teach the students to 'Put a stopper in death'

Well I'd say this could be a bit far fetched but I say let's go for all those wild interpretations!! :lol: Other than symbolic lines the Sev/Lily relationship explains a lot why Snape hated Harry but was almost always there first when Harry was in trouble. :)

[FUNiRepBlue]

I loved it. I thought it was a great wrap up to the series.
I only had one thing spoiled for me but it was at the beginning of the book. I decided to stay offline until I finished reading it. (I even heard on certain WoW servers jerks were shouting spoilers in the chat)

I'll be curious to see what JK might try to write next. I wouldn't mind a whole new cast of characters in the same world.
I heard Movie 6 is due in 2008 and then movie 7 we can expect in 2010. I can't wait.. I'm still hoping we get some Harry Potter Action in HD though.

[Bezerker]

The Years 1-5 Boxset on HD-DVD & Blu-Ray comes out in December. I'm going to buy it even though i know they're gonna come out with a really nice boxset (like they're releasing for the books in September (http://images.barnesandnoble.com/images/13040000/13045291.jpg)) for all 7 movies.

But considering we've got another 4-5 years til the 7th dvd will be out, I guess it'll be worth a double dip.

[Sushikins]

The Years 1-5 Boxset on HD-DVD & Blu-Ray comes out in December. I'm going to buy it even though i know they're gonna come out with a really nice boxset (like they're releasing for the books in September (http://images.barnesandnoble.com/images/13040000/13045291.jpg)) for all 7 movies.

But considering we've got another 4-5 years til the 7th dvd will be out, I guess it'll be worth a double dip.

Damn, that box is nicer than I expected, guess I'll be drawing even more money out of my account for HP again this year.

[Nano]

After seeing this picture............
http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l25/david_aniki/b15847156.jpg
He became my favourite character.

[Alice Catherine]

After seeing this picture............
http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l25/david_aniki/b15847156.jpg
He became my favourite character.

WIN.

(filler)

[tsuki no miko]

After seeing this picture............
http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l25/david_aniki/b15847156.jpg
He became my favourite character.

OMG That is so funny!!! :lol::lol::lol
I looked around for other DH parodies or fanart at Devianart.com and had tons of fun. :)

[mdauben]

I just finished reading the book, and was at least a bit disappointed. I would say its probably my least favorite of the series. Just too... dark overall (although the last couple of books have been getting progressivly darker). It did have both good and bad aspects too it, but in the end I liked it mainly just becuase it wrapped up the story of all the characters.

I liked Snape's ending. Although Snape was a completely unlikeable person, he was a one of the best characters in the whole series. I liked the way his story was wrapped up in the pensive, and was glad to see he ended up with a very sympathetic death.

I like the way that Neville got to be a hero in the end. Him running around with all those dangerous plants in the climactic battle was just great, and I was glad he ended up a teacher in the epiloge. Great place for him.

Speaking of the epiloge. I liked it. In general I tend to like "x years later" epiloges where you can see what happend to every one, but it was nice to see confirmation that Harry and Ginny got married and that Ron and Hermione got married. I thought Harry and Ginny's second son being named Albus Severus was a nice touch, too.
The "Deathly Hallows" thing seemed really contrived and pointless to me. The horcruxes were enough of a quest for the final story, I think the whole book would have been better off without the additional distraction of the Hallows.

There were just way too many deaths in this book. Mad-eye, Fred, Remus, Tonks, Dobby, etc. I mean, she even killed off Hedwig for crying out loud! There were just so many that it diluted the significance of any one of them, other than just lending to the general depression of events. I mean, given the way the final battle played out, some people had to die, but I guess I just though the whole final battle was too violent and bloody and detracted from the Harry/Voldomort conflict.

In the final battle, Neville beheads Voldomort's serpent with the Sword of Gryphendor. Great for Neville, but how did he get it? I thought that sneaky little Goblin made off with it during the escape from Gringots, but then all of a sudden Neville has it. Did I miss something?

Hermione getting tortured by the Death Eaters. Maybe it's just me but I hated that scene.

Dumbledore wasn't a saint when he was younger? So what? Again, like the Deathly Hallows I though that was kind of pointless, and added nothing to the story other than another excuse for Harry to get all emo (as if he didn't already have enough).

I didn't care much for the way Ron was handled though most of the story. In the end he came around, but he was a whinny ***** or was just missing for way too much of the story.

Neville and even more so Ginny needed a lot more "screen time" in this book. We know second hand that they were fighting the good fight at Hogwarts, but nothing substantial. I would have loved if Rowling spent the time that was wasted on the whole "Deathly Hallows" buisness on those two characters.

After all the complex and deadly traps on the horcrux in the sea cave, he just dropped the final horcrux in the "Room of Requirement" sure that no one would ever find it, even though it was full of evidence (piles of hidden items) that probably hundreds of people had been in and out of that room over the centuries???

I wish the Harry/Ginny romance could have been fleshed out a little more. It was like, they finally got together at the end of the last book, and then other than Harry thinking about her occasionaly during this one there was pretty much nothing until the epiloge (and even there, it wasn't much beyond the fact that they got married and had a family). There was no real development of the actual relationship. They didn't even get a good reunion scene after the final battle.).

Harry was the godfather of Remus and Tonks son, so I would have loved to have seen something come of that. He does not even appear in the epiloge, other than in a refernce to him in the coversation between Harry, Ginny and their son.

While I suppose it was not necessary to the story, it would have been nice to see a bit more development of the relationship between James and Lily. They just jumped from Lily thinking James was an arogant jerk, to them being happily married.
In the end I would only give it about a 6.5 out of 10. :naughty:

[Alice Catherine]

While I suppose it was not necessary to the story, it would have been nice to see a bit more development of the relationship between James and Lily. They just jumped from Lily thinking James was an arogant jerk, to them being happily married.


It had everything to do with Snape, though.

[mdauben]

It had everything to do with Snape, though.
True. The Lily-James leg of the Lily/James/Severus triangle was the least important of the three to the story (other than the fact that it produced Harry!) so it was not real loss to the story. It would have just been nice to see.

[Alice Catherine]

True. The Lily-James leg of the Lily/James/Severus triangle was the least important of the three to the story (other than the fact that it produced Harry!) so it was not real loss to the story. It would have just been nice to see.

In a love triangle all parties have equal importance. If James was just as bad as Sev, why did Lily end up marrying James? I know it's not important. It's just REALLY annoying.

[Quiel]

I didn't like the Harry resurects thingie I know it's supposed to be a childrens book but I can't stop thinking DBZ'ish sorry I think it must have been cooler to not ressurect him. Yep I know it's supposed to be a childrens book.

things I like is the Prince tale chapter. and I felt sad when he bit the dust all he wanted to do was look in lily's eyes for one last time before he went.....

[mdauben]

I think it must have been cooler to not ressurect him. Yep I know it's supposed to be a childrens book.
I don't know. I think personally, I disagree. I found the book depressing enough. If it had ened like that I at least would have been really PO'd. :P

[lost7]

I nearly put it down when Hedwig died. I mean come on. HEDWIG? ORLY? She killed the freaking OWL for crying out loud.


PETA is not going to like this.......

[Nano]

Read into the story a little bit more will ya? She killed the bird because it had no use at all in the story, and would have been a waste of words refering to it during the story just so we know it's there and she didn't forget the bird was still alive. Harry was too busy to look after the bird, and it would have just been left at the burrow most likely alerting the death eaters he was there or left at grimwald road (or whatever it's called) because Hermione wouldn't pack the bird in that little handbag of hers would she? The bird had no use to the story, and keeping it in the story would have been too hard or far fetched, that's what I think.

[hiei_kurama27]

I finished Deathly Hallows last night. Throughout the series, I liked each book more than the last. So you could guess this one was my favorite of the seven.

I was glad that the book had a change of scenery instead of another year at Hogwarts. Everything kept me wondering and eager for an answer, and a lot came to me as a surprise.

There were too many deaths of loved characters, it just made you think 'why was that necessary?'. Fred for instance, both Tonks AND Remus. Ted is just like Harry now. ;_;

I was thinking about Snape and Dumbledore, and everything about their deaths. When you think about it, Snape's death was unnecessary yet inevitable due to Voldemort's thought process.

In 'The Prince's Tale' I gained an enormous amount of admiration of Severus. You finally knew how he felt about Lily and Harry, and his loyalty truly lied with Dumbledore to the bitter end. That was the best chapter of the book. :)

I also laughed when Harry was deceiving Voldemort, playing dead. I just thought how funny the shock would be to everybody when he would spring to life after Voldemort declared him finished by his hand. Neville turned out to be super awesome.

I rather enjoyed the epilogue, though the names of their kids... XD Albus Severus Potter.

[mdauben]

Read into the story a little bit more will ya?
I can "read into the story" just fine, thanks. <_<

Obviously, Hedwig had no place in the story but that does not mean she needed to just be pointlessly killed off. On top of all the other deaths, her's added nothing to the story except upping the body count, which IMO was too high anyway.

He could have left Hedwig in the care of any number of other people. The Weasly's, Hagrid, or even Remus were all known to have connections with Harry, so them having his owl would not have told Voldomort or the Death Eaters anything they did not already know..

[Dorktron2000]

Obviously, Hedwig had no place in the story but that does not mean she needed to just be pointlessly killed off. On top of all the other deaths, her's added nothing to the story except upping the body count, which IMO was too high anyway.

He could have left Hedwig in the care of any number of other people. The Weasly's, Hagrid, or even Remus were all known to have connections with Harry, so them having his owl would not have told Voldomort or the Death Eaters anything they did not already know.

If the owl had lived, it would have had to live in a cage the entire time. It was perhaps a brusque metaphor, but I think it conveys an important point: that living safely but confined would have been the same as death. The will to move forward even through adversity seems to be an important point.

Hey, but I really agree with the point about it taking up unnecessary pages to detail; It prevented the meandering that bogged down some of the previous novels.

Also, I'm going to agree with a lot of outside sources and say the epilogue was poorly written.

[Caine]

If the owl had lived, it would have had to live in a cage the entire time. It was perhaps a brusque metaphor, but I think it conveys an important point: that living safely but confined would have been the same as death. The will to move forward even through adversity seems to be an important point.

Hey, but I really agree with the point about it taking up unnecessary pages to detail; It prevented the meandering that bogged down some of the previous novels.

Also, I'm going to agree with a lot of outside sources and say the epilogue was poorly written.

except that he's ent Hedwig off on her own for times before. he could hav just set her free, or at least somewhat free. As for meanering, well, this book had enough of that.

I agree that Ginny and Neville needed more screen time.

I think that James isn't ever really shown as an adult because it would jsut be more pages and wasn't really necessary.

I though that the depth that was added to Dumbledore was interesting, but I didn't find it necessary (then again, I found 97.5% of Harry's emo unnecessary)

[Dorktron2000]

except that he's ent Hedwig off on her own for times before. he could hav just set her free, or at least somewhat free. As for meanering, well, this book had enough of that.


It's been attacked before, it will probably be attacked again if it was set free. Possible scenario:

"A white owl? That belongs to Harry Potter."
"Let's follow it."
"This is boring." - Death Eater then kills the owl.

The End.

[Alice Catherine]

It's been attacked before, it will probably be attacked again if it was set free. Possible scenario:

"A white owl? That belongs to Harry Potter."
"Let's follow it."
"This is boring." - Death Eater then kills the owl.

The End.

Spoiler tagz plzkthxbai.

[Dorktron2000]

Spoiler tagz plzkthxbai.

It's not a spoiler. First part draws from a previous book, latter part is a hypothetical situation.

[tsuki no miko]

Neville pulled out the sword from the sorting hat, remember?
It just didn't happen to appear suddenly.
Only a true Griffindor can get it and Neville has shown all that as he confronted Voldemort.

I'd say Lily choosing James over Severus was because Severus started going down the path of Dark Arts. Also I don't think her feelings for Severus was beyond something between "best friends".

[Haro!]

I haven't read the book yet nor any of the spoilers but could someone please tell me this isn't how it ends:
Harry, Ron. and Hermione are sitting in diner listening to Journey's "Don't Stop Believin'" while waiting for Cho to park (because its a known fact that not even in fiction do Asians know how to drive) and then it just abruptly ends and you think you got a book with a missing page?

[mdauben]

I haven't read the book yet nor any of the spoilers but could someone please tell me this isn't how it ends:
Dang! You should study Divination with Miss Trelawney, as you are obviously clairvoyant! :lol:

[Nano]

Neville pulled out the sword from the sorting hat, remember?
It just didn't happen to appear suddenly.
Only a true Griffindor can get it and Neville has shown all that as he confronted Voldemort.

I'd say Lily choosing James over Severus was because Severus started going down the path of Dark Arts. Also I don't think her feelings for Severus was beyond something between "best friends".

SPOILER TAGS SPOILER TAGS!!!!! USE YER DAMN SPOILER TAGS, please.

[Nutmeg]

About Hedwig.... JK addressed that in this interview. There are a lot of questions answered and a lot of spoilers.... click with caution.

http://www.mugglenet.com/app/news/full_story/1156

[goddessofanime]

I haven't read the book yet nor any of the spoilers but could someone please tell me this isn't how it ends:
Harry, Ron. and Hermione are sitting in diner listening to Journey's "Don't Stop Believin'" while waiting for Cho to park (because its a known fact that not even in fiction do Asians know how to drive) and then it just abruptly ends and you think you got a book with a missing page?

Nah...actually it was

Hermione woke up in bed and went to the bathroom where Harry was showering. Harry's all, 'It was just a dream..."

[Ryuuichi009]

...I liked Deathly Hallows...until the final 3 chapters then it just annoyed me...

<_<

It was just to much of a "happy ending" Ugh...don't even get me started on the whole "Albus Severus" thing... -_-

[Haro!]

SPOILER TAGS SPOILER TAGS!!!!! USE YER DAMN SPOILER TAGS, please.
Hey don't talk to my ideal unattainable woman that way!

Anyway I really should read this book as it seems I'm the only one I know that hasn't read it. Oh and this past week they had the guy who does the HP audio books on "Wait Wait Don't Tell me!" which was pretty awesome.

[Vaikyuko]

I laughed at the interview. "In a novel you have to resist the urge to tell everything." Not a fan of Victor Hugo, is you, Ms. Rowling? Or general fiction, for that matter.

I personally thought Deathly Hallows was better than the abysmal fifth book, but on par with the also very bad third. I maintain that the fourth and sixth books are the best.

There were way too many plot holes in this for me to really enjoy it. And regarding the whole "Rowling uses Chekhov's Gun effectively!" thing...no, no she doesn't. She does the exact same thing I do when I write something new. I BS a beginning into existence, fill in a huge ton of details, then come up with a plot and/or ending that is at least partially different from the original vision, cut half the details, and try to make the rest fit. It usually works like a charm and most people think it's advanced planning when you're really just making it up as you go.

I was also furious with the wedding that occurs in the book, among a few other things. It serves no purpose other than to waste pages and inflate her paycheck, because I bet sure as hell she gets paid on commission per line.

[Nano]

I was also furious with the wedding that occurs in the book, among a few other things. It serves no purpose other than to waste pages and inflate her paycheck, because I bet sure as hell she gets paid on commission per line.

I wondered why she was using double spaces....

[Vaikyuko]

Well, it seems to be an older custom to use double spaces. My mother does it as well, no idea why, she said it's proper (which is bull, but naturally I corrected her and it's all good).

Yes, I am an *** like that. :P

[Ryuuichi009]

I was also furious with the wedding that occurs in the book, among a few other things. It serves no purpose other than to waste pages and inflate her paycheck, because I bet sure as hell she gets paid on commission per line.

It also explains why she wrote all of those boring camp scenes where they were doing nothing but sitting on their a**.

[Shiroiyuki]

I was also furious with the wedding that occurs in the book, among a few other things. It serves no purpose other than to waste pages and inflate her paycheck, because I bet sure as hell she gets paid on commission per line. [/COLOR]

Well, actually, the wedding scene was useful for a few different reasons:

Doge whateverthehellhisnamewas was introduced to us as being a full-on supporter of Albus Dumbledore, shedding a little bit more light on D's past during his little scene. Sure, his version of what happened wasn't *exactly* spot on, since it was clouded by severe adoration, but a few more tidbits of information was revealed in that scene that sort of...added to the whole 'Dumbledore's past' subplot. I kinda felt bad for the old guy, too.

We are also introduced to Ron's aunt who had a darker version of Dumbledore's past to tell, speaking of old Bathilda Bagshot (who we actually 'meet' later on, even though it turns out to be a trap). It gives you a chance to familiarize yourself with Bathilda's name, so that later on that whole scene in her house makes sense to you as a reader. If Rowling had just casually threw Bagshot's name into the story without reason, chances are you wouldn't have connected the two events properly. Ron's aunt also plants doubt in the reader's mind as to whether or not Dumbledore was as perfect and saintly as everyone thought--giving you reason to believe that he may, in fact, hated muggles and mudbloods in his younger years and lashed out against them.

Also, showing Luna's father all dressed up to the T during the wedding (to highlight how run down and grubby he looked after Luna was taken) was also well done. If we had no previous information about his odd (but elaborate) preference on clothing, and had just been introduced to him when he looked like a scruffy hobo, I think that would have taken away from the desperation felt during that scene later on at his home. Where was Luna? Why did he look so horrible? What happened to the polished, but odd, old guy we had seen before? There would be nothing to compare his actions/dress with during that stressful time if not for the wedding scene. We'd just assume he was a slob. No contrast whatsoever, no sense of danger/dread to be felt by readers.

I dunno, maybe it was just me *shrugs*

[Vaikyuko]

No, not really. She's a bad writer, because there are easier ways for people to recall things like that. For example, Hermione mentioned Bagshot as the author of A History of Magic, and even if one didn't see that and missed it, her name was mentioned in practically every single one. It should at least be familiar to anyone who actually reads the books. Rowling is a horrible, horrible writer, but she's great at inflating her page counts with filler. In fact, the least filler'ed up book was the fourth. The fifth is almost all filler, the seventh has way too much, and the six has a large chunk but it thankfully doesn't completely suck.

[StandingAlone]

No, not really. She's a bad writer, because there are easier ways for people to recall things like that. For example, Hermione mentioned Bagshot as the author of A History of Magic, and even if one didn't see that and missed it, her name was mentioned in practically every single one. It should at least be familiar to anyone who actually reads the books. Rowling is a horrible, horrible writer, but she's great at inflating her page counts with filler. In fact, the least filler'ed up book was the fourth. The fifth is almost all filler, the seventh has way too much, and the six has a large chunk but it thankfully doesn't completely suck.

Alright, come one. You say she is a bad writer, well millions of other people say otherwise. She may not be able to string long, extravagant sentences together but she is one of the best storytellers the writing world has seen. It shows too (hence being one of the most discussed authors in the 21st century and being richer than the queen because of her books). So stop ranting about how bad she is.

[Dorktron2000]

I was also furious with the wedding that occurs in the book, among a few other things. It serves no purpose other than to waste pages and inflate her paycheck, because I bet sure as hell she gets paid on commission per line.

I laughed. I don't know if you're serious or not, but I'm sure her contract is a little more generous than that. Also:

Well, it seems to be an older custom to use double spaces. My mother does it as well, no idea why, she said it's proper (which is bull, but naturally I corrected her and it's all good).

Do you not like double spacing anything, like rough drafts, etc.; I'm fairly sure it's part of a CMS rule somewhere. In general, it's easier on the eyes.

[Vaikyuko]

@StandingAlone: Tell that to my English degree. Millions of people saying someone is a good writer does not mean said person is a good writer. Try picking up something like Les Miserables, Brave New World, The Lord of the Flies, The Catcher In The Rye, etc, and tell me that Rowling is as good a writer as a Sir William Golding or a J.D. Salinger.

@Dorktron2000: I hate double spacing anything, it serves no purpose unless you're using like...size eight font or something ridiculous like that. And I'm sure that at the beginning, before Harry Potter made any money, her contract was as such. You would be surprised at how many times major novelists tend to end up with (while yes, slightly more financially stable) contracts based on line-by-line commission.

[KatayokuのTenshi]

It doesn't look double spaced in my copy... maybe it's just the American version?

[StandingAlone]

@StandingAlone: Tell that to my English degree. Millions of people saying someone is a good writer does not mean said person is a good writer. Try picking up something like Les Miserables, Brave New World, The Lord of the Flies, The Catcher In The Rye, etc, and tell me that Rowling is as good a writer as a Sir William Golding or a J.D. Salinger.

Actually, I have read all those books and no she is not as good as them, but she is still a good writer. So what if you have an English degree (would you like a cookie?) do you really think I care, um... no! I think I sense a bit of elitism here or maybe a bit of jealousy. And saying something like this...

Millions of people saying someone is a good writer does not mean said person is a good writer.

WOW. Isn't an author's whole purpose to get people to read and love their work? That is what any author wants and Rowling was able to achieve this with more people than many could dream of.

Just to say a writer sucks is just stupid all together. Literature is extremely subjective and cannot be based just off one person's opinion. Maybe say something like, "Her writing style does not appeal to me". Or maybe don't say anything at all.

Oh and why did you continue to read all 7 books if you hate her so much?

[Cow]

Finished the book, loved it. The parts I enjoyed most were about Snape.
All in all, I don't see Harry's dad, James, as a great character. Kind of an atypical wizard jock in a sense who married the beautiful smart Lily and had a cute spawn. I say I don't see him as a great character in the sense that, in a way I have a lot of hatred toward him for the way he treated Snape.

The ending was fitting, anticlimactic, definitely; but the journey of the Horcruxes was so vast and time consuming that another huge epic battle would not have seemed fitting. Voldemort's death was ironic, and boy do I love irony.

I liked how in the Epilogue Harry named his son Albus Severus, thank god Snape got a little recognition.

About Hedwig.... JK addressed that in this interview. There are a lot of questions answered and a lot of spoilers.... click with caution.

http://www.mugglenet.com/app/news/full_story/1156
Here she introduces Luna, who becomes in all sense a major character, and she doesn't say what happens to her in the book. That is the only stupid thing with the Epilogue, the part about her discovering new breeds really should of been in there. Stupid J.K. Rowling. I guessed that Neville and her would get together, I guess I was wrong.

Also who the hell is the current head master?

[Dorktron2000]

@Dorktron2000: I hate double spacing anything, it serves no purpose unless you're using like...size eight font or something ridiculous like that. And I'm sure that at the beginning, before Harry Potter made any money, her contract was as such. You would be surprised at how many times major novelists tend to end up with (while yes, slightly more financially stable) contracts based on line-by-line commission.

I'm sure her current contract is a little more lucrative now, considering she is one of the wealthiest people in Britain, much more than could be simply achieved solely through the licensing of her works.

Also double spacing is amazing for papers. It helps so much in editing and grading; I can understand a hatred for it in the Harry Potter books, since it's kind of an absurd level. Also, it's part of the Chicago Manual of Style as part of the essentials of manuscript form, and most people follow the CMS since it is so inclusive.

On another note, even mediocre authors, like Rowling, can stumble upon good writing (see Thackery's Vanity Fair). Also, you've already gone through college?

[Cow]

@StandingAlone: Tell that to my English degree.

You're 17 and you have an English degree?

[StandingAlone]

Finished the book, loved it. The parts I enjoyed most were about Snape...

Here she introduces Luna, who becomes in all sense a major character, and she doesn't say what happens to her in the book. That is the only stupid thing with the Epilogue, the part about her discovering new breeds really should of been in there. Stupid J.K. Rowling. I guessed that Neville and her would get together, I guess I was wrong.

Also who the hell is the current head master?


Yeah, Snape was for sure my favorite character in this one. There are a lot of reason why but mainly because he is one bad mofo!

I could have sworn that Neville and Luna would hook up too. But that was the only prediction I missed. I predicted almost everything else correctly, except the way everything turned out was a lot better than what I expected.

I also want to know who the head master is. Could it possibly be Mcgonnagall? If there is any one else it could be, do tell.

[Vaikyuko]

@StandingAlone: Mmkay. Incidentally, I continued reading the books because I was eleven when I started, and I hate leaving things unfinished. Ever. Oh, and you say you sense a bit of elitism and jealousy? Damn straight I'm jealous of a woman who can produce subpar work and make millions from it. Elitist? Eh, mayhaps a little, I'll give you that.

Again, just because millions of people read her works doesn't make her a good author; it makes her a popular one. All authors strive for popularity, because it sells. But does a popular book equate to a good book? Not really, no. I'll cite Dan Brown as having some of the most trite and boring books I've ever read, yet people swear by him and say he's a genius. Yes, it's subjective, but I don't particularly care. It's also my opinion, and giving it is part of what a message board is all about. Kthxbai.

@Cow/Dorktron: I have a partial degree at the moment. I never did say I finished it. But that's besides the point. Regarding the headmaster, didn't Rowling say it was someone new and not McGonagall, but mentioned no specific name? I believe I read something akin to that in an interview posted a few posts back.

The double spacing for papers is helpful, yeah; I recall grading a bunch of research papers around twenty pages each for an old professor of mine, made it extremely easy to read. But for a novel of any kind? Nope. Not buying it. :P

[Cow]

Saying "Tell that to my English degree" means you have an English degree, (which of course I did not believe for a second, from a 17 year old.) so basically a partial degree from a 17 year old means, you took some AP classes in high school?
If thats the way you deceptively write, join the government with your rhetoric.

[Vaikyuko]

Not AP classes, I dual enrolled and took out a rather large chunk of my degree early, graduated from high school a year early too. I find it amusing that you say I write deceptively; didn't someone else (StandingAlone, to be specific) say writing was subjective only a moment ago? Please don't insult my intelligence by saying I write rhetoric or that my skills would suit me to a government job, either, if you would.

But regardless, I care not for petty internet squabbles (hell, this post is more than I usually give). I'm going to just lurk around this topic for the time being, considering the reception I've had was anything but cheerful or accepting (well, Dorktron and a few others were civil/nice). Once again, kthxbai. :P

[StandingAlone]

Not AP classes, I dual enrolled and took out a rather large chunk of my degree early, graduated from high school a year early too. I find it amusing that you say I write deceptively; didn't someone else (StandingAlone, to be specific) say writing was subjective only a moment ago? Please don't insult my intelligence by saying I write rhetoric or that my skills would suit me to a government job, either, if you would.

But regardless, I care not for petty internet squabbles (hell, this post is more than I usually give). I'm going to just lurk around this topic for the time being, considering the reception I've had was anything but cheerful or accepting (well, Dorktron and a few others were civil/nice). Once again, kthxbai. :P

I was not trying to be offensive, I was just trying to get the point across of writing being subjective, which you humbly accepted. No one is trying to insult your intelligence, we just want to show how pompous you sounded getting on a Harry Potter thread and completely dissing Rowling and her books and saying she is a horrible writer. I could care a less if your opinion of her or her books, I just wanted you to view it from a different angle which it appears you did. Thank you.

Oh, and if millions of people like your work, it usually means you must being doing something right. That's just the way I see it for books.

*Deception can be a writer's best skill, though government officials use it the wrong the way sometimes. Besides rhetoric is a good person speaking well. I think that was Plato ( You should know Trieze- correct me if I am wrong) so being a rhetor is not a bad thing.*

[Dorktron2000]

Not AP classes, I dual enrolled and took out a rather large chunk of my degree early, graduated from high school a year early too. I find it amusing that you say I write deceptively; didn't someone else (StandingAlone, to be specific) say writing was subjective only a moment ago? Please don't insult my intelligence by saying I write rhetoric or that my skills would suit me to a government job, either, if you would.

But regardless, I care not for petty internet squabbles (hell, this post is more than I usually give). I'm going to just lurk around this topic for the time being, considering the reception I've had was anything but cheerful or accepting (well, Dorktron and a few others were civil/nice). Once again, kthxbai. :P

Hey, I just find it amusing pushing people here and there to see how they respond. Also when people say they have a degree I usually expect them to have finished the class, I've seen so many people say they are pre-Med/Bio; most switch after a few semesters.

Anyway, double spacing really helps when you're reading stuff on public transport; I was sitting in the jump seat on a stretch on Lake Shore Drive, and I could barely read my Bantam version of Middlemarch.

[Tenou]

Ok, so I finally went in and picked up my preordered and finished reading it. I must say, the first half was tedious, the second attention getting (enough to make up for the the beginning), but the ending, a whimper and left me wanting more.
I expected more, not in the 'every loose end must be tied up' but more something epic, which this wasn't.
The epilogue... Yeah, I like knowing that Harry had the hetero dream life with a wife and kids... but the series, the morals, the teachings (especially the last few were more than a little didactic) they became the story, not Harry. So the epilogue should have been about the world, not about a couple of individuals readers had become attached to. Something along the lines of (and what I was really expecting) 'and the Wizarding world realized what happens when there is segregation, and how much stronger everyone is when they work together, and the Wizards and Muggles lived happily ever after as equals. That's what all that Goblin stuff and Hermione's speech were leading up to, and it never happened (ok, so centaurs and giants, but that's more helping for their own sake, not an actual bond.

EDIT: Lord thundering, I forgot what it was that I was expecting, I got sidetracked in exposition. I was expecting the Houses to be done away with. Everyone together instead of split into 4... or at least get rid of Slytherin. When they were back at the school, and McGonagall was going to get rid of the tables, but everyone was already mingling together. Now, that means that the separation of houses had broken down, but it was leading me on, with the possibility of getting rid of Houses. If you're going to place a gun on a table, by the end of the story, someone must be dead by that gun by the end of the story.

It doesn't look double spaced in my copy... maybe it's just the American version?
Yeah, it's just the American version. I am so glad that Canada tends to default to UK editions when it comes to books.

And, Treize, my love, I'm afraid that if you actually continue on your academic path and get that degree in English, you will realize that all in all, it's much more useful as toilet paper than as academic credentials. Don't do it.

[hiei_kurama27]

I just wanted to mention: What did everyone think about the 'Snape-shaped hole'? XD I mean, would a window really bear the shape of a person instead of just being shattered glass?

[Vaikyuko]

@StandingAlone: I'm not sure, but it sounds like him. Haven't read Plato in a long time; been on Hugo, Dante, and Milton for a while now.

@Dorktron: Never experienced that phenomenon, because when I travel on public transport and only use my iPod and DS en route. No books of any kind.

@Tenou: Oh my, love? Better be sure Magami doesn't hear about this. In all seriousness, I fully intend on getting the degree regardless of what anyone says (no offense intended, of course). I've also considered a double major with Psychology being the second.

@hiei: It took me a moment to realize what Rowling meant by "Snape-shaped hole". :lol:

[Magami No ER]

^Yea...I'm sticking out of this one. This includes the PM(s) I sent. -.-;;;;;;;;

(Damn Potter and his loaded threads...I'll stick to the movies thanks.)

[Tenou]

Ok, I just read that web chat and it sounds as if she's got another book planned (she's got a funny use of tense, something like real-time. She used present continuous tense a few times... which could mean that she's in the middle of writing.)

I think I'm going to have to agree with Treize, that Rowling isn't so talented.
If this truly is the last Harry Potter book to be written, it left too many unanswered questions and a feeling of... incompleteness. Yes, it's good when a book makes you question, hell, when anything makes you question. Questions are good, are necessary, they make you think, make you grow.
But there should be closure, like, yes, there was a lesson learned or even no, business as usual. But to leave it in limbo (something that other writers have done with applause, but only after they've been dead for a century) to not end the series with a sense of finality, that's just poor spirited.
Like, I was reading a series by this author, and I got to book 3 (of what would probably have been 5) and then she died. Really inconsiderate, that. But the end of that their book, felt like DH. If she has no talent for a satisfactory ending (not necessarily a happy ending, no, but something with finality) then she's not as talented as I thought. Writing a story is easy. It's knowing when and how to end that's hard.

Treize, my dear (more acceptable?), no offense taken. And a double major is a good idea. Means that, while you're doing something you like, you're also getting something useful.

[Cow]

^ Wow another book? See when she says that her vision of Harry is through these 7 books it should be just 7 books. A side book with the world she created I wouldn't mind but an 8th book? I mean come on. I will not be pleased if that happens. If anything, she should of done her original idea and put more into the epilogue.

*Also could you give me a link to that web chat?

Also no offense to anyone, but psychology degree's are a dime a dozen.

[Tenou]

^ Wow another book? See when she says that her vision of Harry is through these 7 books it should be just 7 books. A side book with the world she created I wouldn't mind but an 8th book? I mean come on. I will not be pleased if that happens. If anything, she should of done her original idea and put more into the epilogue.

*Also could you give me a link to that web chat?

Also no offense to anyone, but psychology degree's are a dime a dozen.

I don't think it'll be an 8th book, but something closer to the Discworld series. Read the chat http://www.mugglenet.com/app/news/full_story/1156
and watch when she uses future and present tense. I don't think it's going to be directly about Harry, but the world she tends to use present tense. Harry et al are written in present tense in some cases, but it seems like she's more uncertain about their lives.

[drgenestarwind]

My DH experience was great, i was in London for the release ('splains why i'm making this post nearly three weeks later) so i hung out at the Waterstones Picadilly Circus queue until I went to my own release party, i took a tube back to my hostel and finished it by 10. it is a very fitting end, and i love the Scholastic cover art as much as the Bloomsbury cover art.

[Vaikyuko]

^ Wow another book? See when she says that her vision of Harry is through these 7 books it should be just 7 books. A side book with the world she created I wouldn't mind but an 8th book? I mean come on. I will not be pleased if that happens. If anything, she should of done her original idea and put more into the epilogue.

*Also could you give me a link to that web chat?

Also no offense to anyone, but psychology degree's are a dime a dozen.

So are English degrees, but it's better than going into an extremely saturated field of research dealing with computers and such. :P

And the whole present/future tense thing reminds me very much of a writer making it up as she goes, and pieces fall into place. Which I'm guilty of myself, but hey, who isn't?

[The Million Dollar Prons]

DAMN. That was like the best book I've read since, ever.

It had everything, werweolves having sex with women, characters dying left and right. CHILDREN BEING SLAUGHTERED. SNAKES BUSTING OUT OF OLD PEOPLE. Man I could just go on and on and on. Hot. Damn. This book was fan. tas. tic.

[LeslieSama]

>_> Epilogue= no.

And Snape was very OOC

Did anyone feel that the fight was rather anticlimactic?

I was expecting Harry to die though-just to keep going on with a sequel XD

The Albus Severus Potter thing was really stabbing me

[Shiroiyuki]

And Snape was very OOC

Apparently, he was acting just as Rowling intended...:lol: Who can argue with the author about her characters?

But no, really...shame Alan Rickman isn't just a *bit* younger. :redface: Or, you know, not involved in a 'relationship' (*scoffs*).

Such a dashing actor. You just don't see his degree of sophistication and refinement anymore. *sigh* I'm really looking forward to the last two books turned movie.:smokin:

[Ryuuichi009]

I hated Snape in DH. He acted like some obsessive love sick school boy mooning over a stuck up annoying Mary Sue. But I also hated how Harry was a jerk, Hermione managed to fall for that sexist and ridcolous charm book that Ron used, and Ron was desperate enough to use said book [but that was IC however much I hate it <.<]

[ladyshiro]

I reread the last few chapters again last night.
Can't wait intil it goes into movie form. They better do it right.

[Shiroiyuki]

I reread the last few chapters again last night.
Can't wait intil it goes into movie form. They better do it right.

I sincerely hope that when the seventh book goes to Hollywood, they omit the Epilogue altogether. Why? Because that chapter in my opinion felt rushed and too forced. I honestly thought it didn't do the series justice.

It's not like J.K.Rowling to take a big dump on her work for the last chapter--the important one. The one that was supposed to have a strong impact and some real closure. I dunno, that Epilogue really left a bad taste in my mouth. I think I'd rather not see that brought to film.

[The Million Dollar Prons]

UPDATE: SNAPE DIES.

[Shiroiyuki]

UPDATE: SNAPE DIES.

Yes, um....thanks for that information, Captain Obvious :P. On a more serious note, you might want to put that in spoiler tags (just in case people haven't finished the book yet).

[The Million Dollar Prons]

Yes, um....thanks for that information, Captain Obvious :P. On a more serious note, you might want to put that in spoiler tags (just in case people haven't finished the book yet).

So I guess the gigantic thing in the title that says *SPOILERS* means "There's going to be no spoilers in this thread," and if you were so concerned about spoilers why would you quote me thus increase the chances of seeing my spoilers by over nine thousand?

You get a D, see me after class :(

BTW that scene made me cry. :(

[Shiroiyuki]

So I guess the gigantic thing in the title that says *SPOILERS* means "There's going to be no spoilers in this thread," and if you were so concerned about spoilers why would you quote me thus increase the chances of seeing my spoilers by over nine thousand?

You get a D, see me after class :(

BTW that scene made me cry. :(

Hey, you edit yours, I'll edit mine. :)

I dunno, I get upset when people put critical information about books in threads. Warning in the title or not, sometimes people just don't expect to have something important ruined so easily, especially when the preceeding conversation was a bit light in comparison. *shrugs*

[The Million Dollar Prons]

I dunno, I get upset when people put critical information about books in threads. Warning in the title or not, sometimes people just don't expect to have something important ruined so easily, especially when the preceeding conversation was a bit light in comparison. *shrugs*

Well, let's try this instead

warning there are spoilers ahead
SNAPE KILLS DUMBLEDORE
end spoilers.

Is that better?!

BTW I was also really sad when Dumbledore died. For real what kind of children's book kills the kindest fairest person in the damn universe? HP sure got messed up in the last few books, I'm surprised we didn't see any magical vietnam war veterans suffereing from post traumatic stress disorder or sometnhing. Maybe Snape made a potion that cures that, who knows.

[StandingAlone]

Well, let's try this instead

warning there are spoilers ahead
SNAPE KILLS DUMBLEDORE
end spoilers.

Is that better?!...

That is a hundred times better. Good thing you warned me cause something might have been spoiled that would have made my life cease to exist. Phew! I was scared there for a minute. Thank god for spoiler alerts!

[drgenestarwind]

I was at a bookstore for the midnight release in London and some muggle who had seen or heard something walked in about 10 minutes to midnight with a megaphone trying to spoil people. because of the part of the store i was in i didn't hear anything, which i was glad of. london on DH night rocked.

[DeathlyMoonGoddess]

ok im on chap. 17 or 18..... and so far i luv dish book.... if any body ruins dish book for me I'll be one mad witch with a capal B.