Punching in Zeta

[Ark]

Is it normal for characters in the Gundam franchise to randomly beat eachother up?

[Bernard_Monsha]

No it is why some people refer to it as Bitch Slap Zeta. Camille gets pummled quite a bit namely when he is acting bratty. Bask on the other hand punches people because he is plain mean. Wong Lee should have been included in Evangelion as the head of NERV.

[Sushikins]

It happens, especially when Bright Noa is involved. I think characters fighting each other happens more in Zeta Gundam and G Gundam than in any other Gundam.

[Ark]

namely when he is acting bratty.

I'll be suprised if he lives till the end of the show.

[Suiko Eiji]

I'll be suprised if he lives till the end of the show.

Eh, sort of.

There's actually a large amount of bitch-slapping in the original MS Gundam, too.

Children getting beaten for being stupid and whiney is one of the reasons I love Gundam.

[Prons]

Yeah there's a lot of punching.

In before GIFS

[Ark]

Eh, sort of.

There's actually a large amount of bitch-slapping in the original MS Gundam, too.

Children getting beaten for being stupid and whiney is one of the reasons I love Gundam.

Well Camille seems to like fighting as well.My only problem is when they do it for no good reason like in ep11 when Camille punches Lt Qaudros (sp?).

[Suiko Eiji]

Well Camille seems to like fighting as well.My only problem is when they do it for no good reason like in ep11 when Camille punches Lt Qaudros (sp?).

Camille is very much a teenager - at one moment he wants to be a badass, the next he's off being emo and crying in a corner listening to The Cure. I think it's a good contrast for him, especially since I think he briefly matures for a bit towards the end. It follows a fairly similar model to Amuro but I think Camille was able to pull it off a little bit better.

[Soluzar]

Camille is very much a teenager - at one moment he wants to be a badass, the next he's off being emo and crying in a corner listening to The Cure. I think it's a good contrast for him, especially since I think he briefly matures for a bit towards the end. It follows a fairly similar model to Amuro but I think Camille was able to pull it off a little bit better.
If by "better" you mean "more emo", then I agree. It is certainly Camille that I think of as the more realistic of the two. Despite his occasional descent into whiny behaviour, Amuro usually (in Mobile Suit Gundam) seems far too composed to be an accurate portrayal of a teenager in that situation. Amuro in Zeta, of course, is a rather different story.

On the topic of the thread, to be blunt, I'd have punched Camille myself at least once in the series, had the possibility been open to me. He's a great character, but he can be the most collossal *** sometimes.

[Suiko Eiji]

If by "better" you mean "more emo", then I agree. It is certainly Camille that I think of as the more realistic of the two. Despite his occasional descent into whiny behaviour, Amuro usually (in Mobile Suit Gundam) seems far too composed to be an accurate portrayal of a teenager in that situation. Amuro in Zeta, of course, is a rather different story.

I think the scope of how much Camille is an active character in the franchise detracts from him seeming less emo. If Camille had been able to stick around longer, as Amuro had, I think there would have been a much longer progression. I guess that's a personal fault of mine, because I continue to look at all of the UC through one big picture. To me, Camille fluxed back and forth between ultra-whiny and badass wanna be up until the near end of Zeta, in which he has some small epiphiny right up until "he sees the stars of time" Read: brainfired. However, I believe Camille makes some appearences in subsequent manga/novel stories and I'm not sure at all what he's like in those.

Amuro, on the other hand goes from whiny to matured under fire (with a couple of well placed bitch-slaps in between). His behavior in Zeta, like you cited, is rather different. I like to akin that appearence to what a buddy of mine and I call "The Illuminati Guy"*. He's ultra-paranoid and worrysome. If there were an instance of the Internet discussed in Gundam, Zeta's Amuro could have well been locked in the basement, making posts on forums that would have made Zugzwang seem mildly normal. It's almost an out of place turn for the storywriters to keep Camille the main focus (in order to prevent an incident like "Shinn-Kira" from happening in the UC). Either way, from the end of Zeta up until UC0093, Amuro becomes a competant, confident, and fully matured adult.

Given my lack of knowledge on Camille from the rest of the UC calender, I base all of my assertions on what I saw of him only in Zeta. To be able to make a similar progression to Amuro's (dropping Illuinati Guy stages all together) at a quicker rate is where I get "better" from. However, I could be completely wrong in that stance as Camille's injuries could have really screwed him up a lot more and he could have been Zegz's inspiration. I will leave room that I could be wrong.

On the topic of the thread, to be blunt, I'd have punched Camille myself at least once in the series, had the possibility been open to me. He's a great character, but he can be the most collossal *** sometimes.

I almost ruined a TV trying to get at him...

*"The Illuminati Guy" - one weekend while at a Gun Show with my buddy, there was a guy circulating through the show talking about how the media and finances were controlled by the Illuminati - even national politicians and major parties were controlled by the Illuminati and how they were secretly the ones behind trying to rid all religion in the US so they could be worshipped. I'm not kidding. He actually said that.

I think he could have actually been Zugzwang...

[Magami No ER]

However, I believe Camille makes some appearances in subsequent manga/novel stories and I'm not sure at all what he's like in those.

I can't really get a feel of his personality in the newer Zeta manga <serialized in Gundam Ace> because my kanji reading skills suck, but I do know that he's a lot more brutal in Tomino's novelized Zeta, despite the events in those five novels following the story in Zeta more completely. These novels, if I understand what I've read correctly, are separate from the First Gundam novel(s). As for the ending of the Z novels, with regards to Camille he commits suicide on his own volition <opening is normal suit helmet> after defeating Paps, who apparently didn't "take" Camille's mind because all of the deaths had an even deeper impact on him, particularly Rosami and his parents, wheras Four was closer to his heart in the TV series.
However, I could be completely wrong in that stance as Camille's injuries could have really screwed him up a lot more and he could have been Zegz's inspiration. I will leave room that I could be wrong.

In my personal opinion, Camille (anime) is a bit better at concealing his emotions as a result of his personal tragedies, but not just because he’s seen his older role models do it, but by becoming desensitized to violence, as with any solider. Maybe his martial arts training(despite not seeming that meaningful to him besides as a way to macho up) might have also aided in speeding up this "acceptance." Perhaps then, this indeed hinder(it's certainly not good to always conceal such loud emotions) Camille, but also helped him to go on living, as well.
Considering his outbursts were practically indicating mental instability/unhealthy amounts of rage in the beginning of the series, this change in disposition shows that Camille's a true dynamic character. I guess Tomino's views, at least back then, show a duel side to corporal punishment on teen in pressing situations.

[GUNDAMPILOT]

People need to understand that msg zeta and the rest of the old uc stuff came from back in the day that if you messed up you damn sure where catching a beating. Ya know back in the good old days when a kid acted up in public and he got his *** beat right on the spot.

So when a MS pilot or anyone else for that matter messed up or needed to be reminded of their place it was time to break out the woopin stick.

These days its not cool to toss out a beating for no good reason. So times changed to suit the times. I miss the old days. :lol:

[Suiko Eiji]

he commits suicide on his own volition <opening is normal suit helmet> after defeating Paps, who apparently didn't "take" Camille's mind because all of the deaths had an even deeper impact on him, particularly Rosami and his parents, wheras Four was closer to his heart in the TV series.


Well, damn. Just damn.

[Levon]

I like the scene is Mobile Suit Gundam where Amuro refuses to pilot the Gundam, it goes something like this:

*Bright slaps Amuro*
"How dare you!? Not even my father hit me!" - Amuro
*Bright slaps Amuro again*
"And whats wrong with hitting you? Your a spoiled brat." - Bright

:lol:

[Magami No ER]

Well, damn. Just damn.
I know, my run-on sentences are just dreadful. :P

[Amuro]

Zeta and the aforementioned random fights are just Tomino spouting out his depression and testosterone with little-to-no rational thought whatsoever.

And don't look for consistent charactarization or realistic psychological depth, it's not there. Thankfully, the characters magically revert back to normal for the Char's Counterattack movie.

(Yes, everyone knows I hate Zeta, don't mind me)

[Dr. Nick]

However, I believe Camille makes some appearences in subsequent manga/novel stories and I'm not sure at all what he's like in those.

Bump, for I've found something mildly interesting. Here'a a scan from a manga called Mobile Suit Gundam 0099: Moon Crisis (http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/Dr-Nick/random%20anime/camille_moon_crisis.jpg): as you can see, Camille is there and he's looking quite healthy. Since I don't know any Japanese, I can't tell what else is going on in it. Are he and Fa now married, perhaps?

Dunno how canon this is, but according to ANN the original concept is at least partially credited to Tomino himself.

[Suiko Eiji]

Bump, for I've found something mildly interesting. Here'a a scan from a manga called Mobile Suit Gundam 0099: Moon Crisis (http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y163/Dr-Nick/random%20anime/camille_moon_crisis.jpg): as you can see, Camille is there and he's looking quite healthy. Since I don't know any Japanese, I can't tell what else is going on in it. Are he and Fa now married, perhaps?

Dunno how canon this is, but according to ANN the original concept is at least partially credited to Tomino himself.

I was all willing to help out with a translation (as I am interested in what happened to him) but it fails for being in the wrong moonspeak. Can someone find a Japanese (not Chinese) copy of it?

[Vaikyuko]

I've been hunting for scans of this SOB for a long time. It's tough to find...I have some details in the UC0083~0099 Anaheim Journal artbook, but I can't scan it. Which sucks. I'll pass along the scan to whoever I can find, though.

[Dr. Nick]

Can someone find a Japanese (not Chinese) copy of it?

It's Chinese? Well damn. :lol: Unfortunately that single scan is all I have.

[Suiko Eiji]

^Yeah, only noticible to the trained eye, I suppose. I've done the same with one or two of my own research books; didn't even know it until I opened it up and went "WTF?!?". :lol:

[Prons]

I just gave Suiko a Japanese copy. Who knows, maybe he'll translate it so we can check in on our good friend Camille? IF not we'll cut him.

For everyone else who's into some mangaonly gundam stuff, who CAN TRANSLATE, PM me!

[Suiko Eiji]

I just gave Suiko a Japanese copy. Who knows, maybe he'll translate it so we can check in on our good friend Camille? IF not we'll cut him.

Quit frontin'.

[Quiddity]

Megami no ER wrote:

he commits suicide on his own volition <opening is normal suit helmet> after defeating Paps, who apparently didn't "take" Camille's mind because all of the deaths had an even deeper impact on him, particularly Rosami and his parents, wheras Four was closer to his heart in the TV series.



You know, I honestly wouldn't be surprised with that considering all that Kamille had gone through by the end of the series. I've said many times that I've felt that Kamille's state at the end of Zeta had a lot more to do with all the trauma he went through then a spell that Scirocco cast on him. Is there anything official in ZZ or another source that specifically states that Scirocco fried his brain, or is it just fan conjecture based on Scirocco's final words? I think even if Scirocco did nothing, Kamille would be pretty screwed up after the Gryps war was over. He was suddenly thrust into the position of being the AEUG's main pilot, both parents were killed in front of him, he killed countless numbers of people, he witnessed multiple colonies that the Titans put poison gas into, Reccoa betrayed him, Sarah never turned good despite all his efforts, Emma died in his arms, Four died in his arms, he had to kill his 'sister' Rosamia, it just goes on and on and on...


BTW, here's a nice Zeta montage from YouTube with many of the slappings and beat downs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLU5mFoJtKM

[Magami No ER]

^I rememeber you saying somthing to that effect on MAHQ. But, I do truly believe Paps had some effect on him.
But yeah, what you said does seem to apply to the novel indefinatly.

[nameo9876]

I like the scene is Mobile Suit Gundam where Amuro refuses to pilot the Gundam, it goes something like this:

*Bright slaps Amuro*
"How dare you!? Not even my father hit me!" - Amuro
*Bright slaps Amuro again*
"And whats wrong with hitting you? Your a spoiled brat." - Bright

:lol:

That really turns you on, doesn't it? >D

[Magami No ER]

Yes, Levon is turned on by Bright putting Amuro in his PLACE, Eva-02, and Haman Karn.
The ruff stuff.

On an unrelated note, <3 to yer Harlock.

[nameo9876]

XD

<3s to you too. I haven't been here in quite some time, so I missed the people in the Gundam board. How's it hanging?