Is World of Warcraft popular in Japan?

[kilpatrick]

World of Warcraft is a huge hit in Korea & China, but how does the MMO fare in Japan?

[Prons]

A totally un-translated english World of Warcraft is outselling Gundam Online, that's as far as I know

[VacantEyes]

What's up with this Worlds nonsense? Guild Wars baby!

[MagicianCamille]

A totally un-translated english World of Warcraft is outselling Gundam Online, that's as far as I know

Do those crazy kids have beam sabers yet?

WoW is a great game, Japan needs to recognize.

[windwalker]

WoW never release in Japan yet.
OBLIVION too.

[Powatanner]

i wouldn't know
i don't live in Japan
i did, but they didn't have WoW back then
:P

[hiroaki]

Ranking：Popular MMO (http://www.mmoinfo.net/ranking/log/index.shtml)
　　　　　
2006/01/01～01/31 4010 (votes) Guild wars
2006/02/01～02/28 4752 Master of epic
2006/03/01～03/31 5244 Junk　metal
2006/04/01～04/30 6520 Granado espada
2006/05/01～05/31 6868 Ragnarok online
2006/06/01～06/30 8966 Ragnarok online
2006/07/01～07/31 11005 Ragnarok online

[Ken-Ohki]

Yay Ragnarok! I don't exactly get the listing though. Are those the most popular MMOs listing from each month? Who does the voting?

[hiroaki]

Yay Ragnarok! I don't exactly get the listing though. Are those the most popular MMOs listing from each month? Who does the voting?

yes every month. and they are mmo users

MMOs by which Japanese has played (best 3)

Ragnarok 14.58% (but 72.57% Rag's user stopped playing. because users have many dissatisfaction with the management company.)
FFXI 8.77%
Pangya(golf game) 7.61%

[m_fugue]

mmorpg isn't much of a market to speak of in japan.

[kilpatrick]

mmorpg isn't much of a market to speak of in japan.

Why aren't mmorpgs popular in Japan as much as they are in the rest of Asia, mostly Korea & China?

[Stutz]

Why aren't mmorpgs popular in Japan as much as they are in the rest of Asia, mostly Korea & China?

I don't think online gaming is as big in Japan as it is in China and especially Korea, though someone that's living/lived there may want to correct me if I'm wrong.

[Suki]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7170734078280837335&hl=en

[cris]

MMO's don't do too well in japan compared to rest of the world, match making service stuff would do better. Also, it's the only country inthe world where Arcade still strives, even korea and what use to be the Arcade homeland (America) is dying in this field (now, there's only about 3000 arcades (not including pizza places and stuff..) in America now a days, when there use to be over 15,000 back in eearly 90's

i think i got this source from NY Times or something...around last year

[hiroaki]

Why aren't mmorpgs popular in Japan as much as they are in the rest of Asia, mostly Korea & China?

It is wrong to compare Japan with China and Korea.

PC-9800 series (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PC-9801) monopolized the PC game market in Japan.
and the PC game stagnated because PC had not competed.
(The hentai game alone that can't be treated at Video game has prospered.)

Do not look at the tree, know the forest.

[kilpatrick]

i think i got this source from NY Times or something...around last year

What else you've got from the NY Times, the Americans build the Doomsday Device at same time as the Russians? ;)


But seriously, even with .hack franchises and the fact you can date people in a MMORPG doesn't make it popular in Japan?

Also, I do recall there was an anime version of Raganrok Online

[Ironfrost]

Why aren't mmorpgs popular in Japan as much as they are in the rest of Asia, mostly Korea & China?

You've got the question backwards. You shouldn't be asking "Why are these games not as popular in Japan?", you should be asking "why are they so popular in China and Korea?". And the reason is piracy.

In China, it's virtually impossible to make decent money from selling games directly, because most of your market will just get the pirate version. What's more, most gamers play in internet cafes, so even legal copies will be used by many players. On the other hand, subscription games like MMORPGs are much more resistant to piracy, because you have to pay per-month, and even if many people play at the same cybercafe they still need one account each.

I don't think Korea is as bad as China, but its copyright protection enforcement is still pretty weak by Western standards. As MMORPGs are the best way to make money in these countries, that's what local developers make, which makes that sort of game more popular, making it even more profitable and etc and so on.

[hiroaki]

For South Korea,
An illegal copy has spread by the broadband.
And their companies shifted to MMO as the solution.
In addition, because they have the resident registration number, they can pay easily.

[Westlo]

Who knows Japan might get lucky and their first proper taste of WoW will be with the expansion pack released.

Yay for us beta testing the game for 2 years ;p

[SKaze]

FFXI is pretty popular in Japan. I play it and Japanese are probably more than half of the game's players. Gives lots of opportunities to practice speaking and reading Japanese :)

I don't think WoW would be very popular..it doesn't quite have the same elaborate culture as FFXI..

[Lunay]

Another reason why MMORPG is more popular in China is the fact that they make real money by selling virtual money (called Real Money Trade), not just piracy. They even buy accounts for real money and sell it for a higher price, or use that account to "farm" more virtual money for more profit. If you still don't get it, check this notorious RMT site: http://www.ige.com/

It's sickening for us MMORPG players, but you have to give them some credit for turning a simple concept into a successful business. =P

[himura_kenshin]

FFXI is pretty popular in Japan. I play it and Japanese are probably more than half of the game's players. Gives lots of opportunities to practice speaking and reading Japanese :)

I don't think WoW would be very popular..it doesn't quite have the same elaborate culture as FFXI..
FFXI is also a very Japanese game, whereas WoW is a very American style game - somewhat obnoxious and in-your-face. FFXI has many special events that make very little sense to a westerner with little knowledge of Japanese culture. FFXI is extremely team-oriented, which I can imagine would work well with Japan's group mentality. Aside from being different, an RPG and "American", I really can't see WoW having much appeal to the Japanese market.

John

[SKaze]

FFXI has many special events that make very little sense to a westerner with little knowledge of Japanese culture.

Those are not a problem. You get used to them soon and they do not inhibit the main game flow in any way. They are more like entertainment on the side, mostly seasonal, like for instance the natsu matsuri (summer festival).

FFXI is extremely team-oriented, which I can imagine would work well with Japan's group mentality.

Yes. I think this is the main difference between FFXI and WoW. In FFXI a single player is almost helpless at 75 (the maximum level) compared to what a party or alliance can do. It is extremely difficult to level up to 75 with most jobs without playing in parties a lot, and it is impossible to obtain most good gear without defeating major monsters (which require parties and alliances).
Japanese have a very elaborate culture of party/team play and are mostly very good at it, so it is very much a Japanese game in that respect. The downside is that if you can't fit into that culture, like some foreign players, you are likely to give up quickly and switch to games that are easier for solo play like WoW or Guild Wars.

[Westlo]

Nevermind the fact that at end game Pve & PvP you need to be in a guild to be successful in WoW.

[himura_kenshin]

Yes. I think this is the main difference between FFXI and WoW. In FFXI a single player is almost helpless at 75 (the maximum level) compared to what a party or alliance can do. It is extremely difficult to level up to 75 with most jobs without playing in parties a lot, and it is impossible to obtain most good gear without defeating major monsters (which require parties and alliances).
Japanese have a very elaborate culture of party/team play and are mostly very good at it, so it is very much a Japanese game in that respect. The downside is that if you can't fit into that culture, like some foreign players, you are likely to give up quickly and switch to games that are easier for solo play like WoW or Guild Wars.I loved playing with the Japanese players. They were extremely methodical and precise. Even though I couldn't keep up the conversation, they were very effective at using the auto-translate feature to coordinate strategies with my wife and I and the XP was fantastic. I don't think I ever had a bad experience with a Japanese player.

John

[SKaze]

Hehe yes I agree. I speak conversational Japanese, so for me it is easier, but most good NA and EU players also like playing with Japanese. Since I am a very long-time player (4 75 jobs), I have met bad Japanese players too, but there are really far far fewer of them than bad NA or EU players.

[Lunay]

I will also have to agree that JP players are overall more better than NA or EU. I am not talking skill-wise, either. It doesn't take much talent to play FFXI and do your job right, whether you are a tank, melee, healer or support. What makes a "good" player is the teamwork aspect of it. From my observation, JP players are more team oriented and dedicated. Dedication can mean small things like hours of commitment into a PT, going afk less, etc. NA players on the otherhand is usually the opposite: NA players like to show-off more; example - "look at how much DMG I just did!11". And NA players love going afk. Of course, there are bad JP players as well.. but fewer.

WoW is simply not popular in Japan because it is not global like FFXI. FFXI is also muti-platform, and WoW is not.

[SKaze]

It doesn't take much talent to play FFXI and do your job right, whether you are a tank, melee, healer or support.

Maybe it doesn't take talent..but it takes some effort. For instance, playing RDM or BLU well (especially in solo/HNM situations) is rather tricky. Also I wouldn't say that someone "does his job right" if he does not pay attention to his team's specifics and adapts to them. Some examples would be for WARs to adjust their damage and WS timing to take and release hate so that hits go only into shadows, for WHMs not to use big cures if hate is bouncy, for RDMs to do the right debuffs for the respective party and tank type, and so on....

Another thing is not to panic and play coldly and rationally in dangerous situations. This is something that is a major issue even with 75 NA players..they mostly just think about saving themselves and nothing else. Or, alternatively, slam all JA macros at once and run in head-on...which is about equally bad.

[Lunay]

Maybe it doesn't take talent..but it takes some effort. For instance, playing RDM or BLU well (especially in solo/HNM situations) is rather tricky. Also I wouldn't say that someone "does his job right" if he does not pay attention to his team's specifics and adapts to them. Some examples would be for WARs to adjust their damage and WS timing to take and release hate so that hits go only into shadows, for WHMs not to use big cures if hate is bouncy, for RDMs to do the right debuffs for the respective party and tank type, and so on....

Like I said, it doesn't take much to do your job right. WAR adjusting their damage and WS to his shadows should be common sense at lvl 24, when utsusemi:ichi is available from the Ninja sub. RDM to do the right debuff should be common sense also. WHM controlling hate is also common sense. But common sense is "not" so common at times and it makes me wonder how some cannot do their job right even at lvl 70..... My previous comment still stand, it does not take much to do your job right. I agree that all one needs to do is pay attention.

[Westlo]

WoW is simply not popular in Japan because it is not global like FFXI. FFXI is also muti-platform, and WoW is not.

America
Australia
Europe
China
Korea

WTF do you consider global?

Also WoW is coming to Xbox360 IRRC, not that it needs the subscribers....

I will also have to agree that JP players are overall more better than NA or EU. I am not talking skill-wise, either. It doesn't take much talent to play FFXI and do your job right, whether you are a tank, melee, healer or support. What makes a "good" player is the teamwork aspect of it. From my observation, JP players are more team oriented and dedicated. Dedication can mean small things like hours of commitment into a PT, going afk less, etc. NA players on the otherhand is usually the opposite: NA players like to show-off more; example - "look at how much DMG I just did!11". And NA players love going afk. Of course, there are bad JP players as well.. but fewer.

If FF Online has a userbase of 6 million+ you would have the exact same problems.

[himura_kenshin]

If FF Online has a userbase of 6 million+ you would have the exact same problems.That was a complaint about American FFXI players, not WOW players.

John

[Lunay]

America
Australia
Europe
China
Korea

WTF do you consider global?

Also WoW is coming to Xbox360 IRRC, not that it needs the subscribers....

What I was trying to say is that FFXI is available for PS2, PC, and now XBOX360. And I did not know that WoW was being availble on XBOX360. Anyway, FFXI is "more" global" it seems because I know players from all the country on your list, plus, the Japanese. I cannot speak for WoW since I have never tried it, and don't plan to either.

I have read online that Japanese players do NOT like to pay for MMORPG, that is why Ragnorak Online is/was the most popular. Also, Square-Enix is a Japanese company, Blizzard is American. Maybe that has something to do with its popularity in Japan.

[SKaze]

Like I said, it doesn't take much to do your job right. WAR adjusting their damage and WS to his shadows should be common sense at lvl 24, when utsusemi:ichi is available from the Ninja sub. RDM to do the right debuff should be common sense also. WHM controlling hate is also common sense. But common sense is "not" so common at times and it makes me wonder how some cannot do their job right even at lvl 70..... My previous comment still stand, it does not take much to do your job right. I agree that all one needs to do is pay attention.

Well, I'll agree with "doesn't take much to do your job right" if "right" means "average xp party level". However, even in xp play, there are many advanced little things and tricks with most jobs that take lots of time to learn, and you hardly see anyone ever use. In 4 years, I have only seen 1 NA RDM so far who has recasted Protect on melee without being asked when they had cancelled it during Utsu recast (and that's a guy who has most mage jobs at 75..). Very few THFs actually split SA and TA or use acid bolts. Few MNKs will willingly sub NIN and co-tank with a WAR pre-74 even although it's an excellent combination given player skill. Etc etc. Outside of xp the skill difference is a lot more drastic, particularly apparent in a HNM situation with less than 1 party, because there small mistakes like not casting the right debuff, voking or nuking at a wrong time can kill your entire party. Since I have done that for a very long time, I can also rather confidently say that most non-JP people are bad skill-wise.. what a JP linkshell gets done with 4-6 people, NA often use an alliance for. We call it the Zerg approach from Starcraft :)


If FF Online has a userbase of 6 million+ you would have the exact same problems.

FFXI userbase is somewhere around 2 mil which is not a major difference to WoW. It's a very large game as well. The main difference is that there's so many JP players in FFXI, and next to none in WoW. JP players' unique culture, along with the usually 20+ age, makes stupid stuff like the abovementioned nearly impossible (or rather, very frowned-upon by the other players, which is very severe for most Japanese). I don't know if that's so good in real life - probably not - but it makes playing and communicating with them a pleasure :) In FFXI it also colors down somewhat on the non-JP population, i.e. many players who strive to be top tend to adopt JP playing customs. WoW etc don't have anything like that, and a lion share of it is Western teenagers. So it's not really a surprise that the atmosphere is nowhere as good as FFXI.

[Lunay]

Well, I'll agree with "doesn't take much to do your job right" if "right" means "average xp party level". However, even in xp play, there are many advanced little things and tricks with most jobs that take lots of time to learn, and you hardly see anyone ever use. In 4 years, I have only seen 1 NA RDM so far who has recasted Protect on melee without being asked when they had cancelled it during Utsu recast (and that's a guy who has most mage jobs at 75..). Very few THFs actually split SA and TA or use acid bolts. Few MNKs will willingly sub NIN and co-tank with a WAR pre-74 even although it's an excellent combination given player skill. Etc etc. Outside of xp the skill difference is a lot more drastic, particularly apparent in a HNM situation with less than 1 party, because there small mistakes like not casting the right debuff, voking or nuking at a wrong time can kill your entire party. Since I have done that for a very long time, I can also rather confidently say that most non-JP people are bad skill-wise.. what a JP linkshell gets done with 4-6 people, NA often use an alliance for. We call it the Zerg approach from Starcraft :)

What I was referring to was 'mainly' for EXP situation. However, most of the HNM activities can become a routine, unless you have new people that don't have HNM experience. Know your role, pay attention, its really that simple. If a RDM does not cast protect after a NIN accidentally cancels it, that RDM is either NOT PAYING ATTENTION or he has filters on. If not, then the NIN should at least mention it. Again, it comes down to common sense and paying attention. THF not splitting is situational, if you have WAR, NIN, and THF, two provokes, he can either SATA NIN or split. WAR should be able to get hate back, though. =P If there is no voke other than a tank, of course, he needs to split..... unless, the other DD can get hate back during a WS, then you can SATA+WS. And I will say this again... what is common sense is not very common. And I do agree that most non-JP people are bad skill-wise. I don't care how many 75 jobs you have, by the time one reaches that level, you are expected to know your job. Also, as much as I hate to say this, gears can make 'some' difference and extra boost from yor current merits. That will be the difference between your "ordinary party" and a chain 100+ PT. Skill, stretegy, gears&armors, merits, common sense, focus, anything else we can add to this list? =P

EDIT: I would also like to add that learning is part of paying attention and open mindedness. Skill is a very tricky word because the definition is "an ability that has been acquired by training". Training in real life situation is physical, but in a virtual world, all you do is push buttons, meaning its all knowledge, stretegy, and experience. Knowledge comes from paying attention and learning from others. So, what I'm trying to say is that we are both neither right nor wrong, we are just discussing the different aspects of the word "skill". =P

I'm NA for your information and I can gurantee you that I can do my jobs right and will know my role whether its HNM or just EXP on my RNG, BST, COR, BRD, THF, etc.