Lance of Longinus, what where and why?

[DarthMigit]

Okay I have a question. What exactly is the lance of longinus and where the hell did it come from? I have a theory of my own but it is pure speculation:

The lance was a weapon found buried with Adam in the and is an "angelic weapon" made from the same matter as the Angels, possesing its own AT field, hence its ability to neutarlise/penatrate AT fields.

Can anyone varify this theory or give me a slap if it is utter rubbish. One more thing; what is the lance for in Seele's third impact anyhow? I know that its merger with unit 01 forms the tree of life, but how come? Oh and I know what the lance is meant to represent so could any answers refer to what it is. i.e. there is no way that Jesus was scewered with a 100 ft long red lance.

Cheers!

[Reichu]

Sweep this thread (http://animenation.net/forums/showthread.php?t=188682) for mentions of the Spear -- there is some amount of discussion within, much revolving around recently translated and absolutely crucial information (along with a hidden surprise unearthed from the show). Actually, it's not a bad thread to sit all the way through if you feel up to it.

[DarthMigit]

Sorry, there was an error. Thanks for your help :)

[Reichu]

..."Error"?

[DarthMigit]

yeah, a database error. That's why my answer took so long, sorry.

[neoXellos]

lol ive seen this thread before lol, but that was a loooooong time ago lol. the lance was a wepon...and yeah the lance of longinus is susposed to be the spear the pierced his side (not screwed him >.<!). And Longinus is the suspposed name of the soldier who weilded it

[DarthMigit]

Thank you for re-opening this ancient thread as I am still not satisfied. I know what the lance is supposed to represent but what is it within Evangelion? I still believe is an Angelic weapon, made from the same matter as ADAM and possesing its own AT field. Fuel for this theory comes from the fact that in the Areal episode the lance made a noise suspiciously reminicent of ADAM, as well as the fact that it can neutrilise AT fields.

There is no way a 200 foot long lance could have stabbed anyone human sized, unless Jesus was a giant or something ;)

[neoXellos]

lol who said Jesus was not a giant! lol i had 2 go there.

im with u, (i tend to put relilgious stuff into the mix when i discuss evangellion so humor me) I believe that it actually was the spear that pierced the side of Christ, but was then implanted into adam where the blood of Adam and Christ mixed on the blade and turned it into not just a holy wepon but an 'angellic wepon' as u so put it (and i do agree) im just a conspiracy theorist lol :p

[Defiled one]

Just a stupid theory but did anyone considered the idea that the lance of longinus was a litle abnormal? I mean what we know is that the lance can change shape, it can penetrate any at field, and in Adam case, put her to sleep.. i mean we dont know what happened there in antarctica, Adam was impaled in ice with the lance.. Lilith was found in Japan missing her lower torso regenerating until the humans impaled her with the lance that they took from adam, to stop her regeneration and other stuff... not to mention 1 impact. they said what caused it was asteroid that killed the dinosours or the creation fo the our moon.. and i question.. could it be a lie also made by seele? we werent there... And most importantly what if the lance it self was not made by Adam or LIlith... than who, realy made it? What ever created the lance knew very well AT fields..was there even another being besides the angels?

[DarthMigit]

I appreciate your mirth, but I still find it hard to entirely agree. As far as I can tell, the majority (if not all) of the neo-christianty symbolism in Eva is purely metaphysical. Please correct me if I am wrong, but as an imidiate example the EVA is not the wife of ADAM reborn, but what humanity has created from ADAM. Metaphorically representational of Eve/a.

Am I correct or simply ignorant?

[DarthMigit]

oh by the way, that was directed at Defiled one. forgot to quote, oops!

[DarthMigit]

Just a stupid theory but did anyone considered the idea that the lance of longinus was a litle abnormal? I mean what we know is that the lance can change shape, it can penetrate any at field, and in Adam case, put her to sleep.. i mean we dont know what happened there in antarctica, Adam was impaled in ice with the lance.. Lilith was found in Japan missing her lower torso regenerating until the humans impaled her with the lance that they took from adam, to stop her regeneration and other stuff... not to mention 1 impact. they said what caused it was asteroid that killed the dinosours or the creation fo the our moon.. and i question.. could it be a lie also made by seele? we werent there... And most importantly what if the lance it self was not made by Adam or LIlith... than who, realy made it? What ever created the lance knew very well AT fields..was there even another being besides the angels?

Hmm, interesting. But I see no reason why Seele would conceal the information if they had lied. There is also nothing to suggest that ADAM was impaled with the lance, only that it was found with him.

yay! I remembered to quote! :)

[Defiled one]

I dont know...not to mention that we never knew what would really happed but it would be great for a prequal.... not to mention the dead sea scrolls were they really telling the future?.. or they were just descriving what happened before? somethign conected with 1 impact and stuff... the earth as a constant death and rebirth cicle what if 3 impact was inevitable in order for the earth to survive? a reset button?

[DarthMigit]

What were the dead sea scrolls? That could easily be a code-name for just about anything. It's possible that they could be research documents based on what was known about the previous two impacts and the Angels. They may not fortell the future, simply speculate upon it...

[Defiled one]

or a record as, you said, of past events...

[DarthMigit]

I think the only conclusion I can reach is that as of yet there has been no conclusive information released regarding...anything really. Any theory is just that, a theory. However I dispute the claim that anything religeous is actually going on, it confuses matters somewhat.

[neoXellos]

Indeed it is metaphysical, but could the metaphysical also be symbolic

[Defiled one]

the only thing that we know.. and cannot be changed and all fans agree.. was that we know what we saw... what they say or said can be deceiving currupted by subs and other things.. we only saw.. nothing more, nothing less.. and that is maybe the only conclusion that everybody agrees.. unless of what i see is diferent from what you see.. and them we go again to confusion...and dont know anything again

[DarthMigit]

I don't doubt it.

[DarthMigit]

the only thing that we know.. and cannot be changed and all fans agree.. was that we know what we saw... what they say or said can be deceiving currupted by subs and other things.. we only saw.. nothing more, nothing less.. and that is maybe the only conclusion that everybody agrees.. unless of what i see is diferent from what you see.. and them we go again to confusion...and dont know anything again

However unfortunately with Eva there are so many conflicting opinions of what one is actually seeing. The facts are not as clear as in many TV shows.

[Defiled one]

After ten years we still are in the same level

[DarthMigit]

Damn that Anno!

[Defiled one]

well either he had a really idea of eva.. because its first came in anime then manga.. he realy had been thinking of it.... than again if i recall no one in that time cared about it.. until sudenly "evangelion" appeared... by some strange force... by just a click.. it became big.. we were literaly compelled to watch it.. and then try to figure it out..

[neoXellos]

indeed deflied one, seeing is believeing. i saw it kill an angel wit one hit...therefore, it laughs at AT fields

[DarthMigit]

To be honest, I am a recent Evangelion fan who has been swept of his feet by the power of Anno's masterpeice. And unit 01 laughs at all creatures, man and angel alike because she is a God. AT fields? Might as well be a shower curtain.

[Defiled one]

well i watched hwen it aired at 95.. in my country... at first everything was okay until.. they censor it from tv.... the idiots thought that it was sacrilege...damm idiots..damm relious country

[DarthMigit]

Well I am a resident of the UK. sacrilege is the norm, therefore no censorship. Woo!

[Jabberwok]

There is also nothing to suggest that ADAM was impaled with the lance, only that it was found with him.
This thread (http://animenation.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4224886&highlight=adam+impaled+lance), one of many, may be relevant to your interests, specifically the image links in posts 2 and 6.

However I dispute the claim that anything religeous is actually going on, it confuses matters somewhat.
The creators have said as much.

They claim various symbolism was used because it "looked cool," but I also believe these were used in intentionally vague ways just to keep fanwankers such as ourselves busy for years to come.

With this hanging over my head, with the Black Space God laughing from up on high, I try not to think too hard about any one thing. I dislike jumping through hoops, though I don't necessarily ignore the challenge.

in my country...
Just out of curiosity: "Which one would that be?"

[Defiled one]

my country was portugal...

[DarthMigit]

This thread (http://animenation.net/forums/showthread.php?p=4224886&highlight=adam+impaled+lance), one of many, may be relevant to your interests, specifically the image links in posts 2 and 6.


The creators have said as much.

They claim various symbolism was used because it "looked cool," but I also believe these were used in intentionally vague ways just to keep fanwankers such as ourselves busy for years to come.

With this hanging over my head, with the Black Space God laughing from up on high, I try not to think too hard about any one thing. I dislike jumping through hoops, though I don't necessarily ignore the challenge.


Just out of curiosity: "Which one would that be?"

Those images embaress me to no end. Please forgive my foolish error. Also I am in total agreement that Eva is intentionally vague, hardly a subtle but endlessly amusing way to maintain fan interest. It might even keep us occupied untill LAEM is released.

[neoXellos]

lol i knew i was right lol. Im with yall on this one...they knew what they were doing...they made it with all the symbolism and such to keep us busy...and busy we are lol

[DarthMigit]

Doesn't that give you such a sense of purpose?

[Jabberwok]

my country was portugal...
I was thinking somewhere in Europe, just couldn't figure out where.

I never did watch Eva when it aired recently in the states, though it was in a midnight timeslot, I believe, and the network is pretty cool about a good many things; I hear it survived relatively unscathed. I also don't know if it ever aired earlier here, or with what amount of editing.

I find the varying censorship policies of the world ever so intriguing.

[DarthMigit]

While the UK very rarely got Eva, the censorship was minimal, as in none. YAY!

[Reichu]

1337er version of Adam pic:

http://www.evacommentary.org/full-op/full-op_C234_big.jpg

(Hopefully, it'll look good enough that you won't even be able to tell that I spent hours on it. :P )

[Defiled one]

this is a creepy comparison... wasnt Adam with shoulder blade things when he moved?, in a picture of some sorts..I could be wrong of course.

[DarthMigit]

Image:Adam.jpg

[Defiled one]

but, i cant see it:crybaby:

[Reichu]

The shoulder pylons are a restraint device that the Katsuragi Team put on Adam; they're not part of her actual body.

[neoXellos]

indeed, it gives me a sence of purpose :p nah, i dont care lol. Anyways to get back on topic...apparently it is an ancient wepon that is angellic.

[Reichu]

indeed, it gives me a sence of purpose :p nah, i dont care lol. Anyways to get back on topic...apparently it is an ancient wepon that is angellic.
d00d, do a search in the thread that I linked to in Post #2, and you won't have to toss around speculation like "apparently it is an ancient weapon that is angelic".
http://www.evacommentary.org/forums/images/smiles/sonic_idle.gif

And please, fix your sig. If you're going to have those links, bundle them together instead of putting vertical spaces between them. Space-hog sigs -- and ones that are mostly empty space, at that! -- are Bad. (Check out how compacted mine is, for example.)

[neoXellos]

indeed indeed sir, i shall fix it. but the thread was 2 long man...just to long! I cant read all that, i have problems reading my own posts and you see how short they r lol.

[Reichu]

In the second horizontal grey bar from the top, there's a box that says, "Search this thread". Plug "Spear" into that, and it will give you all of the posts that mention "spear", including the one with the translation of the "Spear of Longinus" Classified Information entry. (I'm trying to get you to be self-sufficient. ;) )

Out of curiosity, do you normally call women "sir"? :P

[TS-Scorpio]

One thing I wasn't sure about that Adam pic was whether the Spear was going through her back or through her front.

The shoulder pylons are a restraint device that the Katsuragi Team put on Adam; they're not part of her actual body.

Is there proof of that? Once Lilith was no longer restrained, her form as a large humanoid blob took a more specific shape. Adams form here is similar to the restrained Liliths, and so once the Katsuargi team did what they did (remove the Lance etc) she became the EVA-esque form we see.

[Reichu]

One thing I wasn't sure about that Adam pic was whether the Spear was going through her back or through her front.
Seems to be impaled through the sternum (a la Lilith later), with the tines of the Spear emerging between the scapulae.

Is there proof of that? Once Lilith was no longer restrained, her form as a large humanoid blob took a more specific shape. Adams form here is similar to the restrained Liliths, and so once the Katsuargi team did what they did (remove the Lance etc) she became the EVA-esque form we see.
Proof of what? The pylons' function?

Lilith just seems to be a big, humanoid blob by default; she remains one even after regenerating. The discrepancy between Adam's physique in that image (which, even rendered vague by her partially-exhumated status, I wouldn't quite compare to Lilith) and that seen in the Giant of Light seems to be one of those unaccountable things. EVA-01, in the Maternal Nightmare pic, isn't quite consistent with the lankster we know and love, either.

[DarthMigit]

The shoulder pylons are a restraint device that the Katsuragi Team put on Adam; they're not part of her actual body.

Perhaps...but as has been mentioned, there is no direct evidence to support that theory.

Consider this...the Eva's are clones of Adam deliberately "toned down" in order to make them controllable. It is possible that the shoulder parts existed naturally on Adam and were deliberately removed or removed as a consequence of keeping the Eva's power in check. However the design of their armour emulates the original shape of Adam's body.

Possible? Unlikely, the aforementioned theory makes a great deal more sense but it is another idea for one to chew over.

Why does everyone refer to Adam as "she"? I had always believed Adam and Lillith to be male and female respectively as a result of their opposite and opposing abilities...

Heh heh, mabey I should accidentally post this three times. Are you listening Reichu? :P

[Defiled one]

No, Adam was the name the scientists gave to her.... it is a she in a sense because all angels are from Adam...now Adam could not be entirely male.. in order to have children so has lilith... so the plausible cause was that they were futanari... both of them in order to have offspring.... unless there was another being "which i doubt"

[DarthMigit]

Obviously Adam produced the Angels asexually. However while he/she/it may possess no specific gender I had always considered he/she/it to be a male force and Lillith a female force. They are all powerful creators, they require no other entity to create life.

[TS-Scorpio]

Changed my mind, the pylons are not a natural extension of the EVAs (as seen whenever EVA-01 goes bersek/loses "bindings"), so neither should they belong to Adam.

[DarthMigit]

It is clear that the Eva's lack shoulder parts (harpies lack them, unit 01 loses them) however it is still possible that they may have physically existed on Adam and were simply removed as part of the process of making the eva's controllable, but still emulated in the armour they ware.

Remember the Eva's are not exact clones of the first angel, but what man has made from what was taken from him.

[Reichu]

Consider this...the Eva's are clones of Adam deliberately "toned down" in order to make them controllable. It is possible that the shoulder parts existed naturally on Adam and were deliberately removed or removed as a consequence of keeping the Eva's power in check. However the design of their armour emulates the original shape of Adam's body.
Ritsuko makes it clear in #19 that the pylons are "restraints". They were PUT THERE because they do something to keep the Evas' inherent power in check. You can see the direct cause and effect relationship in EoE: Once Yui pops off her pylons, her two wings of light immediately reform into four. (More wings is a visual cue of more power.)

Why does everyone refer to Adam as "she"? I had always believed Adam and Lillith to be male and female respectively as a result of their opposite and opposing abilities...
"Adam" is just a name. You can take things as you will, but the Seeds and the Evas don't, to my knowledge, have anything inherently "male" to them. Lilith and the Evas are represented in a solely maternal (and sometimes "explicitly female") light. Adam is the one from whom such maternal entities were "copied", with a "masculine alignment" further negated when Kaworu refers to Adam as "the entity that is our mother". Adam -- and, yes, even her rather androgynous ("male, but just barely") Lilim-bodied avatar Kaworu -- also fit into NGE's very big "Mother" theme.

As for reproduction, the only actual hintage in the show towards the Angels' ultimate origins (that I'm aware of) is that Adam may have been carrying them all along. Depends on what you take from the embryonic entities featured in the DSS here:

http://www.evacommentary.org/episode-23/23_C317_npc_23_big.jpg

(I'll try to make a better version sometime.)

Your options are either (A) unborn Angels, or (B) First Ancestral Race. If Seele's rambling is any indication, there might be something about Adam's kids already in the Scrolls, as if Adam's parenthood was "planned" in a way. But I really don't understand how the hell the DSS work, either.

Kaworu's genesis... is a whole other matter.

Complicated issues, at any rate, though I think a male alignment for Adam is unjustified, even though it seems to be the "obvious" choice. The name can be considered meaningful in other ways. (Probably inevitable that discussions about Adam will have different pronouns flying left and right... Kind of like when people of different POVs talk about God.)

so the plausible cause was that they were futanari...
DO NOT WANT

both of them in order to have offspring.... unless there was another being "which i doubt"
Well, Lilith gets kinda pregnant-looking after Zero takes the Spear out. Yet more evidence that the withdrawal technique just don't work. http://www.evacommentary.org/forums/images/smiles/hahaha.gif

[DarthMigit]

I would like to note regarding the whole shoulder thing that I explicitly mentioned that it was an unlikely theory that Adam physically possesed them.

And I am afraid that I will always consider Adam to be a male force. A la God takes from Adam and creates women, man takes from Adam and creates Eva.

Just because the Evas are most definately female holds no bearing on Adam.

Lillith pregnant...hm, interesting...but I am afraid I consider the idea unlikely. I think her pregant apearence is simply symbolic as her role as the mother of mankind, however Lance + Lillith...what would THAT result in?

[Reichu]

And I am afraid that I will always consider Adam to be a male force. A la God takes from Adam and creates women, man takes from Adam and creates Eva.
Are you watching a wonky Japanese sci-fi, or reading the Torah (a.k.a. Old Testament)? :coughs politely:

And remember Dr. N. Akagi and her "three wise men", two of which embody "Mother" and "Woman". :ph34r:

Just because the Evas are most definately female holds no bearing on Adam.
If they're "copies"/"clones"/whatever, it sure as whole-wheat hot dog buns does.

Lillith pregnant...hm, interesting...but I am afraid I consider the idea unlikely. I think her pregant apearence is simply symbolic as her role as the mother of mankind
The pregnant belly was added to the NPC episodes, and I've yet to hear a satisfactory explanation for it, even from myself. :P

[DarthMigit]

Are you watching a wonky Japanese sci-fi, or reading the Torah (a.k.a. Old Testament)? :coughs politely:

Very amusing. I would like to note that I am not a religeous person and have never so much as touched a Torah, but I know of the symbolism to which Eva relates and I am telling you Adam is 100 per cent man. Also, what do you mean by "wonky"?

And remember Dr. N. Akagi and her "three wise men", two of which embody "Mother" and "Woman"

Do you refer to the actual wize men as female? Adam was supposedly male, the wize men are most definately not said to be female, hence that is a flimsy argument.


If they're "copies"/"clones"/whatever, it sure as whole-wheat hot dog buns does.

THE EVA'S ARE NOT EXACT CLONES OF ADAM!!! Why must I keep repeating myself??! They are what man has created from Adam, not mere copies!!

[Defiled one]

why dont we strip the evas naked? drools... to see who is right of course...

Serioulsy its just theories... and we choose the most logical one.. of course we are talking about evangelion so.. even the most craziest idea can be the right one.

[DarthMigit]

why dont we strip the evas naked? drools... to see who is right of course...

You are one sick, sick man. THE EVAS ARE BLOODY HORRIFIC MONSTERS!! If THEY turn you on, then I seriously hope I never meet any girlfriend of yours.

Not to get personal, but seriously back to topic. The lance, I am still not satisfied as to its origin or exact nature.

[Reichu]

ZOMG its teh evas (http://evacommentary.org/omake/xhe.html) http://www.evacommentary.org/forums/images/smiles/fappery.gif

[Defiled one]

ZOMG its teh evas (http://evacommentary.org/omake/xhe.html) http://www.evacommentary.org/forums/images/smiles/fappery.gif


:P I always loved those cristmas pictures.....

[Soluzar]

why dont we strip the evas naked? drools...
Reichu? Are multiple accounts allowed? :P

[DarthMigit]

What have I gotten myself into?!

[Reichu]

Reichu? Are multiple accounts allowed? :P
It's probably more due to this phenomenon:

I am Reichu, a 4-dimensional source of ultimate evil who wants to be you, pretends to be you, and follows you both online and offline. I slowly assimilate others into my Reichu Fake-Reality, creating an increasingly potent and dangerous Borg-like superbeing. The supervibrous g-string reaction produced when the Reichu Hive-mind encounters unstable hermeticists within a biofeedback loop generates metavirii such as Conspiramecium montauki and Paranoiaphilus sp., to which Reichu is immune.

Some are capable of resisting the Reichu Hive-mind. Reichu is still determining what measures are needed to correct this error and proceed with her ultimate objective.

What have I gotten myself into?!
The wacky world of Eva fetishism. (Did you know that some guys use Evas as side dishes? It's true.)

[DarthMigit]

And what a world it is. Can we please go back to the topic now?
(thinks - I wonder if an Eva got pregnant they would have to resize its armour) AH! MY HEAD!!!!!!!!!

[Mr. Tines]

You are one sick, sick man. THE EVAS ARE BLOODY HORRIFIC MONSTERS!! If THEY turn you on, then I seriously hope I never meet any girlfriend of yours.

I never thought anyone would give Reichu such a perfect straight feed line... :lol: May you never meet any furries (yiff! yiff! yiff! :devil: )

@Topic
The lance - really the nigh-transcendent equivalent of a Swiss Army knife; though why it doesn't just manifest as utility fog by default, I don't know.

[Reichu]

(thinks - I wonder if an Eva got pregnant
I've actually done drawings of that. http://www.evacommentary.org/forums/images/smiles/devil.gif

they would have to resize its armour)
Preggers Eva in battle? That'd be teh funnay.

I always DID want Yui to reip Zeruel ("is she taking its organ into herself?"), with the climax being, of course, her biting his face off.

[DarthMigit]

I recommend some great maternity armour for 40 meter tall Gods incarnate on uradumbass.com. Look it up and let Yui and her sweetheart zeruel know.

[Defiled one]

I've actually done drawings of that. http://www.evacommentary.org/forums/images/smiles/devil.gif


Preggers Eva in battle? That'd be teh funnay.

I always DID want Yui to reip Zeruel ("is she taking its organ into herself?"), with the climax being, of course, her biting his face off.


we never knew what happened afterwards... what we saw... was some chunks of flesh.... we still did not know what Yui kami-sama did with her spare time before deactivating herself. :devil:

Welcome to eva Darth.. you will soon get use ot it....A also saw some eva pregy pictars

[DarthMigit]

Actually, in the slightly re-tweaked but still fairly reminicent manga, the counter measures for an Angel attack (i.e. lots of rope) were used to stop unit 01 as she rampaged through New-tokyo 3. Therefore we can assume that her mind was still on the task of brute destruction and not upon satisfying her dark-desires (if indeed the destructive and not all that constructive eva's possess any urges of that kind). I for one am safe in the knowlege that the attack on zeruel could be considered murder and cannibalism, but not rape apparently.

[Reichu]

Actually, in the slightly re-tweaked but still fairly reminicent manga, the counter measures for an Angel attack (i.e. lots of rope) were used to stop unit 01 as she rampaged through New-tokyo 3.
As if that stuff could possibly stop a god. ROLLEYES.

Therefore we can assume that her mind was still on the task of brute destruction and not upon satisfying her dark-desires (if indeed the destructive and not all that constructive eva's possess any urges of that kind).
Evas are people. Didn't you watch the show?

If you're talking about the anime, you can't "assume" anything from the manga. Bad, BAD!

I for one am safe in the knowlege that the attack on zeruel could be considered murder and cannibalism, but not rape apparently.
Yeah, but it's funny.

A also saw some eva pregy pictars
Were they mine? :huh:

I never thought anyone would give Reichu such a perfect straight feed line... :lol:
Hells yeah, dog. Just like old times. Might even get the old juices flowin' again, if you know what I mean. :shifty:

May you never meet any furries (yiff! yiff! yiff! :devil: )

http://www.evacommentary.org/images_capdoc/reichu_asuka_donotwant.jpg

(If furries "yiff", what do Evas do?)

The lance - really the nigh-transcendent equivalent of a Swiss Army knife
The CI just talks about it being a "security device"; nothing else is said. Wouldn't the "Swiss Army Spear" concept be qualified for limbo ATM? (Or did I miss something?)

though why it doesn't just manifest as utility fog by default, I don't know.
Speak language Reichu can understand, gyaaaar!

I recommend some great maternity armour for 40 meter tall Gods incarnate on uradumbass.com.
Forsooth! Thy razor wit hath strucken me down!!

[Mr. Tines]

Speak language Reichu can understand, gyaaaar!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utility_fog

[DarthMigit]

As if that stuff could possibly stop a god. ROLLEYES.

Well they must have retrieved her somehow...

Evas are people. Didn't you watch the show?

I would imagine that when Adam's DNA was altered to create the Evas, their libido would have been removed. Can you imagine how hard and Eva would be to deal with during their "ladies days". And odly enough yes, I did watch the show and Ritsuko said that the Eva's are human on account of the human soul within them. They are monsters/angels with the soul of a person, a soul does not affect or influence bodily functions.

(If furries "yiff", what do Evas do?)

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRR RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAA WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!
I believe.

Forsooth! Thy razor wit hath strucken me down!!

Sarcasm belies a soul arife with insecurity, (look at me! I'm quoting! I'm a genius!) ;)

[Defiled one]

actualy an angel and a human.. in a dna test doesnt varies too much...and i mean really...afterall rei is a hybrid just has kaworu.. so an angel an a human dna are "almost" identical...after all humans are...."gets Dragged away by Seele guys"

[DarthMigit]

ALMOST. But not just human enough I would imagine. Angels are solitary creatures
"Rei to Armisel: We are many but you are alone." I would believe they reproduce asexually in the same way Adam produced them and Lillith created us. If Eva's are Angels then they simply can not possess any desires of that nature. It-just-isn't-right!!!.

[Reichu]

And odly enough yes, I did watch the show and Ritsuko said that the Eva's are human on account of the human soul within them.
Not from what I recall... She said, "And from Adam, humans were made in the image of the God." That makes good sense, considering Adam is "the first human being", who gave birth to "the other Angels, a race of humans who abandoned human form".

ALMOST. But not just human enough I would imagine. Angels are solitary creatures
"Rei to Armisel: We are many but you are alone."
Armisael was also the last of Adam's natural offspring. Their solitary nature may not be something they had any say over. (By the time another appeared, all of the prior siblings were dead.)

If Eva's are Angels then they simply can not possess any desires of that nature. It-just-isn't-right!!!.
Evas are humans, Angels are humans, and Lilim are Angels. :P Come now -- it's perfectly alright. We're all the same.

Well they must have retrieved her somehow...
The only possible way they would be able to is if she went dormant on her own. It would be counterproductive for Yui to stomp around roaring much longer than necessary -- she isn't an idiot.

afterall rei is a hybrid
Since when?

[DarthMigit]

The only possible way they would be able to is if she went dormant on her own. It would be counterproductive for Yui to stomp around roaring much longer than necessary -- she isn't an idiot.

Yep, she kinda is. Because while unit 01 possesses Yui's SOUL, which is NOT a physical body part, Unit 01 only has its own brain, i.e. the soul of a human in the body of a lower animal/beast. I have never seen an Eva perform any tasks more cerebral under their own steam that beat an enemy into a gooey pulp. The pilot does the thinking, not the evangelion.

YUI FANS DONT SUE! >_<

[Defiled one]

see episode one.. she rose an arm to protect shinji... that is another task

[DarthMigit]

But hardly one which required a great deal of brain-power. More like instinct, all animals instinctively defend their young.

[Defiled one]

the eva it self is just a body...."angels" possesed to fruit of life S2 core i think... and humans possesed the fruit of knowledge, the ability to think. the only way for shinji to pilot was of his mother.. who allowed only him. her thinking is dormant... due to shinji control.. when it goes bersek we see in fact Yui... but in a instinc mode.. probaly her reptilian brain working.. kill or be killed...I think it would be good for them to think rationaly..nerv knew that.. Gendo knew that..I mean.. you go there and sudendly shinji sees his mother"eva" talking to him normaly?...I mean that would be messed up...not to mention..asuka talking to her mother inside eva, shinji talking to him inside eva.

[DarthMigit]

I have never seen an Eva think rationally. Never even heard of it, I see no benifit this would bring in a weapon.

[Defiled one]

it would bring none.. i mean eva unit one talking.. shinji would be like

YUI- why dont you date one of those girls? they seen prety nice...

Shinji- mom......

YUi- I talked to Asuka mother her daughter has a crush on you.. and Rei often smileS at you....

shinji- mom....

YUI- hows your father doing? He has been so...grumpy lately...did you now that the night we conceived you...

SHINJI- MOM!!!

YUI- thats okay shinji you are in the age to know these things....

Shinji-Not when I am piloting you.. lets talk later.. okay?

YUI- "mischevious" ohh... my little shinji feels uncomfortable when he is inside of me..Uh?

SHINJI- MOM!!!! STOP THAT!!"

[DarthMigit]

Could be even worse if Yui was going through her period:

Shinji- Come on mom PLEASE help me out here.

Yui- Why should I sync for YOU. You have NEVER appreciated ANYTHING I do aroung here. You think it's easy protecting the Earth from utter annihilation AND keeping you in house and home. Not to mention dealing with that father of yours...!

Shinji- PLEASE!!!! Mom that energy torus is building...

Yui- And if that bastard doesn't think I know what he's been up to with that Naoko ***** AND her daughter!

Shinji- OH MY GOD!! MOM HURRY! SPEAD THE AT FIELD!!!

Yui- I mean, am I wearing a sandwich board that says TREAT YUI LIKE DIRT or something!!! I CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE!!! (Tears the positron rifle from its supports and hurls it into a cliff, destroying it).

Shiji- NO! MOM WE NEEDED THAT!! OH GOD, OH GOD AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Yui- Shinji? SHINJI! OH GOD MY SON!! WHY WHY???! (Breaks down into into violent tears and devours an entire convoy of ice-cream trucks wimpering "I am sorry, I love you, I love everyone so much" between mouthfuls).

You see? Difficult...

[Reichu]

Yep, she kinda is. Because while unit 01 possesses Yui's SOUL, which is NOT a physical body part, Unit 01 only has its own brain, i.e. the soul of a human in the body of a lower animal/beast.
The soul of a human in the body of an uber-human, you mean.

The soul encompasses the mind and the consciousness, BTW. This is NGE we're talking about.

[NeonZ]

The soul encomp***** the mind and the consciousness, BTW. This is NGE we're talking about.

That might be true, but it's not as direct as you imply. Otherwise, Rei would have no memory problems after having her soul taken to another body, nor would she ever forget that she was actually Lilith. Obviously, the body does have some importance to the mind.

[DarthMigit]

That might be true, but it's not as direct as you imply. Otherwise, Rei would have no memory problems after having her soul taken to another body, nor would she ever forget that she was actually Lilith.

Rei was not Lillith!! She was the Lilin vessel of the soul of lillith. The soul is a part of you but it is not all of you!!

Obviously, the body does have some importance to the mind.

That I agree with, when I see an Eva pass her remidial degree in economics then I will believe that they have any kind of intellegence. Untill then, Evas are dumb.

[Reichu]

Well, if you're looking for "basic" signs of intelligence... there's tool-using. EVA-01 uses Sachiel's disembodied rib as a weapon in #02. She also pulls the Spear out of nowhere in #26' and does wacky stuff with it that nobody except she understands. The ability to use tools in completely incomprehensible ways might be considered advanced intelligence. :P

But seriously. I don't think you're looking at the complete picture. Very misunderstood are the Evas. :hands DarthMigit his "Official Eva Bigot" certificate:

[Defiled one]

Yui kami-sama just likes to tease...everybody likes to have fun once in while.. although I never thought Yui kami-sama was a gurist after the foreplay with Zeruiel.

[DarthMigit]

Well, if you're looking for "basic" signs of intelligence... there's tool-using. EVA-01 uses Sachiel's disembodied rib as a weapon in #02. She also pulls the Spear out of nowhere in #26' and does wacky stuff with it that nobody except she understands. The ability to use tools in completely incomprehensible ways might be considered advanced intelligence.

But seriously. I don't think you're looking at the complete picture. Very misunderstood are the Evas. :hands DarthMigit his "Official Eva Bigot" certificate:

I think the Evas are really cool! Just not all that bright therefore I hand back your certificate as I am not an Eva bigot. Basically what you are saying is that Evas are as intellegent as otters or monkeys, THEY ARE LOWER ANIMALS AND SO ARE THE EVAS. That does not mean I dislike them.

[Defiled one]

Yeah you wouldnt like evas.. than again the only thing that made me confused in their appearence was the chest part of them...I watched all the evas, at least the basic pictures of them and i still dont understand why..Eva unit one has a bigger chest than the others... I mean she is a clone of Lilith the others are from Adam.. maybe its was for more protection? who knows...:(


http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/5397/eva2dxc0.jpg
http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/723/eva00pa5.jpg
http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/4838/eva01ac9.jpg

[DarthMigit]

Perhaps unit 01 is simply more generously endowed?

[felineki]

(If furries "yiff", what do Evas do?)They "nuke", among other things, don't they?
YEva unit one has a bigger chest than the others... I mean she is a clone of Lilith the others are from Adam.. maybe its was for more protection? who knows...:(I think that's just an illusion from the different armor configuration she has. While most of the other Evas have that fairly flat, triangular breastplate, 01's has the elaborate pectoral sculpt, and those additional purple "flaps" that wrap around the chest from near the armpit.

[DarthMigit]

http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/B00007JWNK.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg
Isn't it interesting how the boy's plug suit emulates the Eva's armour, whereas the girl's is basically a garish wet-suit?

[DarthMigit]

Look at my nice new profile!

[Mr. Tines]

it would bring none.. i mean eva unit one talking.. shinji would be like

Like this (http://www.ravnaandtines.com/eva/ka-san.jpg), you mean :naughty:

[Defiled one]

IoI its not the first time i see this pic...anyway I also have a thing.. that could be funny.. remember when shinji got pulled in the eva 400 over ratio i think.. didnt he saw a white form of a woman with long hair? well in the end of EOE we see eva unit one.. with an aparent white silver hair the same of that figure... hence my conclusion...which is...eva got silver hair? serioulsy what was that woman..figure, ilusion etc? could you give me at least the link for an old post? since I got nothing concerning this comparison. T_T

[Mr. Tines]

which is...eva got silver hair? serioulsy what was that woman..figure, ilusion etc? could you give me at least the link for an old post? since I got nothing concerning this comparison. T_T

I think that's meant to be Yui, even though we know she had short hair in life.

Evas with long white hair:
Concept art: http://www.evacommentary.org/images_misc/yamashita_megami-shourai.jpg
As realised: http://www.evacommentary.org/episode-m26/m26_C459_i_big.jpg

[Defiled one]

http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/6247/yamashitamegamishouraihy3.jpg

was it really Gainax who made this?.. than i can say that that is how eva unit one looks :lol: bursts laughing....

Hey Darthmigit they are ugly animals I agree with you "sarcasm"


huh!!! must resist.... must resist!! in putting lame joke....cannot resist.. power of the Almighty Reichu is too strong..

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/3644/reichushinjiyuidanceao7.jpg

Image originaly posted by Reichu

[DarthMigit]

huh!!! must resist.... must resist!! in putting lame joke....cannot resist.. power of the Almighty Reichu is too strong.

Never fear, the power of Adam's mighty AT field shall protect you from the monsterous fower of the evil hyperbeing that is Reichu!

http://wwwsshe.murdoch.edu.au/intersections/issue7/images/broderick2.jpg

But seriously, there is a very important fact we are all forgetting here. Eva's are monsters, horrific beasts of terrible and attrocious power.

THEY DON'T NEED LOOKS!!!

[Defiled one]

at least now I know why unit one had a bigger chest plates :lol: serioulsy I cant stop laughing....


serioulsy if that was revealed to be truth it would be a schocking revelation... really big one.

not to mention when rei self destructed... for few seconds a white form began to materialise...Human like...

[Reichu]

The illustration with the Eva-amazons is by Ikuto Yamashita, who (with Anno) is responsible for the Evas' original designs. I have no idea what the deal with that particular image is, or this, either:

http://www.evacommentary.org/episode-16/16_C254_anim_small.gif (http://www.evacommentary.org/episode-16/16_C254_anim.gif)

[TS-Scorpio]

Plothole? How Shinjis mother looked before they actually drew her?

[Reichu]

The montage of newspaper clippings from earlier ends with a photo of her and Shinji.

http://www.evacommentary.org/episode-16/16_C247B_col-disc_mid.jpg (http://www.evacommentary.org/episode-16/16_C247B_col-disc.jpg)
("Mother was smiling...")

And after Shinji "recognizes" the female figure that emerges from the light as "Mother", we see this:

http://www.evacommentary.org/episode-16/16_C257_anim.gif

Check out the genga. (http://www.evacommentary.org/images_production/groundwork_16_C259.gif)

[DarthMigit]

I guessed unit 01 was yui the second I saw a picture of the two together...
http://www.negenerv.com/eva01.jpg
http://z003.ig.com.br/ig/63/37/172005/blig/anime4everybody/imagens/yui.jpg
Can no one else see the obvious resemblence?

[Defiled one]

Yui-kami sama is a wild woman!!! you cant mess with her.. she messes with you... at anyplace, at anytime... be very afraid

[DarthMigit]

Oh don't worry, I am. VERY AFRAID.

[SonGokuQ]

I guessed unit 01 was yui the second I saw a picture of the two together...
http://www.negenerv.com/eva01.jpg
http://z003.ig.com.br/ig/63/37/172005/blig/anime4everybody/imagens/yui.jpg
Can no one else see the obvious resemblence?

Lol. Yeah, they look exactly alike, twins even.

[Defiled one]

Nahh this is GENDO VISION.. his gl*****, the gl*****.

[DarthMigit]

Clearly we have run out of things to discuss. Therefore I shall end this thread in a dignified manner, via quoting the sales pitch for EoE and posting a long list of images from the movie, in the true spirit of "The End". By the way, you may continue if you wish, but you shall strip this post the right of a dignified dimise, so go right ahead, if you think you will ever be able to live with yourself with that knowlege in mind. Farewell! See you next post...

"Beyond jealosy and betrayal; beyond hate and desire; beyond pain and death; lies the ultimate revelation; the final choice; the end"

http://members.aye.net/~gharris/blog/endeva-2.jpg
http://www.productionig.com/contents/works/images/eva/eva_end_web.jpg
http://www.evangelion.tv/Multi/eoe.jpg
http://www.dvdtalk.com/reviews/images/reviews/142/1123270111.jpg
http://evangelion.gemz.org/images/end-of-evangelion/feva020.jpg

[Defiled one]

Drools......serioulsy I am salivating here...Damm you!!! just kidding...

noooo my friends.. a good way to end this thread is this!!!

Come on sweet Death.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rX_FUgR8sdc

[DarthMigit]

"sniff". I agree, that is the way to end this tread. My eyes are filling so I will simply say for the second...and final time. So long my first prolonged thread...thank you for the days!

[neoXellos]

This thread will never die...there is no point to kiling this thread...there are 2 many explinations besides what was already mentioned here...like, perhaps the lance never rele existed in the first place, it was simply a metaphysical thing that if u believed in it it existed...(got the termanology wring but ohwell)...2 many things it could be....MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[Reichu]

The Spear is an alien lifeform that looks like a giant, red pitchfork, and, in fact, the First Ancestral Race ship out all of their Seeds with one of these for extremely mysterious reasons. So mysterious that no straightforward explanation is forthcoming. We know only that the Spear will do whatever is required by the script, whether it be knocking Seeds out, piercing ATFs and killing stuff, roaring like Evas, forming Trees of Life, shooting out of Evas' open maws from absolutely nowhere, making Cosmic U-Rays that destroy phony Spears, etc....

[DarthMigit]

The Spear is an alien lifeform that looks like a giant, red pitchfork, and, in fact, the First Ancestral Race ship out all of their Seeds with one of these for extremely mysterious reasons. So mysterious that no straightforward explanation is forthcoming. We know only that the Spear will do whatever is required by the script, whether it be knocking Seeds out, piercing ATFs and killing stuff, roaring like Evas, forming Trees of Life, shooting out of Evas' open maws from absolutely nowhere, making Cosmic U-Rays that destroy phony Spears, etc....

AAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGG!!! How could you? I had finally achieved some closure over this topic! I would like to note that I was asking if the lance was a living creature SINCE THE VERY BEGGINING OF THIS THREAD!!! Nobody seemed to agree with the idea... We had already reached the conclusion that there is not enough information revealed about the lance to come to any definate conclusions.

THERE WAS NO NEED TO RE-OPEN THIS THREAD!!

[Reichu]

Dude, it flatly states that the Spear of Longinus is a lifeform in the NGE2 Classified Information I was trying to get you to look up. :P

Stop shouting. It's rude, yo. If you're going to do that, you need to throw some chairs around, too.

[DarthMigit]

Dude, it flatly states that the Spear of Longinus is a lifeform in the NGE2 Classified Information I was trying to get you to look up. :P

Stop shouting. It's rude, yo. If you're going to do that, you need to throw some chairs around, too.

"Help me...help me...somebody please...HELP ME!...DON'T LEAVE ME ALONE!...PLEASE DON'T KILL ME!!!"
(Throws chair)

Sorry, sorry. It's just that I was so adamant that this thread should end there, then again that was only because discussion had reached a point of no return...

Okay, If someone could answer this question I would be exceedingly greatful:

When the harpies wield the phoney lances in EoE, why are they first disguised as those big hulking useless greater lances? Seems that all that achieved was ensuring that unit 02 absolutely pulverised the mass productions for the remainder of its operational perameters.

Also, how come unit 02 didn't enter berserker status before it was too late?
I mean it's soul was fully active at that point and Asuka was in danger. Why did Kyoko not save her?

[Reichu]

When the harpies wield the phoney lances in EoE, why are they first disguised as those big hulking useless greater lances?
The script calls them "Heavy Spears". (Elsewhere, they're just called "swords". :shrugs: )

As for why they're disguised that way as first, the only practical reason anybody's come up with is "coolness factor".

Seems that all that achieved was ensuring that unit 02 absolutely pulverised the mass productions for the remainder of its operational perameters.
She took down... like... three with the Heavy Spear. (Cut one in half, got one through the shoulder, took the lower leg off another.) After to-be-spikehead jumped her, she abandoned it. Dunno why...

Also, how come unit 02 didn't enter berserker status before it was too late? I mean it's soul was fully active at that point and Asuka was in danger. Why did Kyoko not save her?
Good question. I came up with a theory that what happens with EVA-02 and Asuka in #25' involves Kyoko using Asuka as a "bridge", in a sense, to bypass her restraints and control her body; and Asuka's not truly piloting as she has in the past, although she doesn't realize it. (A "deeply immersed spectator.") Accordingly, Kyoko needed Asuka to be alert and responsive in order to do anything, hence why she could 'awaken' as the Eva once she got Asuka going. And, perhaps, why she couldn't "go berserk" until Asuka overcame the incapacitating vicarious pain (from the ravaging) and manifested the desire to KILL.

Well, at least Kyoko finally got her wish.

[DarthMigit]

Interesting theory...but Asuka obviously had a high level of control over the Eva as she announced the moves she was going to make: e.g "I've still got my AT field!" field spreads, Eat this! Eva attacks, Screaming and making battle-poses as she strikes, and manually operated the controls.

Nope, Asuka was most definately piloting that Evangelion.

While you ponder a new theory consider this. How come some of Asuka's wounds were visible(peirced bleeding eye, split arm) and others were not (disembowelment). At first I thought that this could be explained by the plug suit "holding her together". However, this does not explain the split limb...

Also, wounds suffered in an Eva had never before manifested themselves physically beyond depression of the skin, why only then? I mean, Asuka's real arms didn't fall off during the fight with Zeruel.

[Magami No ER]

This old thing is relevant to your questions and stuff. Sorry about the broken image links.
http://animenation.net/forums/showthread.php?t=161090&highlight=asuka%27s+wounds

(don't read any of my old posts contained within, they're probabaly no good.)

[DarthMigit]

So basically having read the thread, no one knows...Why did the plug suit tear damnit! Don't bother answering that, no one knows anyway.

[Blader5489]

As for why they're disguised that way as first, the only practical reason anybody's come up with is "coolness factor".

I'd imagine that they would be more effective as weapons in their Heavy Spear form.

Good question. I came up with a theory that what happens with EVA-02 and Asuka in #25' involves Kyoko using Asuka as a "bridge", in a sense, to bypass her restraints and control her body; and Asuka's not truly piloting as she has in the past, although she doesn't realize it. (A "deeply immersed spectator.") Accordingly, Kyoko needed Asuka to be alert and responsive in order to do anything, hence why she could 'awaken' as the Eva once she got Asuka going. And, perhaps, why she couldn't "go berserk" until Asuka overcame the incapacitating vicarious pain (from the ravaging) and manifested the desire to KILL.

Well, at least Kyoko finally got her wish.

What? Of course Asuka was piloting Eva-02. The only role Kyoko played (prior to the Eva going bersek) was to motivate Asuka not just to continue living, but to (literally) slaughter anything that threatened to kill her. The only time Kyoko herself actually took over was when Eva-02 went berserk, which is the whole point of the berseker mode to begin with: when the pilot loses control and the Eva's soul takes over.

[Reichu]

Nope, Asuka was most definately piloting that Evangelion.
Then why was Kyoko making vocalizations of her own? Eh? For example:

[at approximately the same time]
Asuka: We were always together, Mama!
Kyoko: (low growl)

In addition to Kyoko's roaring, growling, and grunting, the "beacon" eyes, cross-shaped explosion, and utilization of advanced ATF powers (the hi-jump, offensive "net", and such) are NOT standard pilot fare.

While I ponder your theory
Fixed. :P

...consider this. How come some of Asuka's wounds were visible(peirced bleeding eye, split arm) and others were not (disembowelment). At first I thought that this could be explained by the plug suit "holding her together". However, this does not explain the split limb...
The so-called "bleeding eye" (actually two wounds, since, you know, the Spear had two tines) and the split arm, and whatever unpleasantries occurred after the latter, happened during powered synchronization. Kyoko was disemboweled while the entry plug was unpowered. Connection? You tell me.

Also, wounds suffered in an Eva had never before manifested themselves physically beyond depression of the skin, why only then? I mean, Asuka's real arms didn't fall off during the fight with Zeruel.
What happens in episode #25' is W-E-I-R-D.

What? Of course Asuka was piloting Eva-02.
If "piloting" can take account of the various weirdnesses, I might find that "of course" more convincing.

I should also note that the 'awakenings' of EVA-02 and EVA-01 are intimately linked together via NGE's trademark visual parallelism. Why?

Additionally, think of the two other instances where the soul of the Eva "goes to" the pilot. In episode #14, the soul of EVA-00 makes contact with Shinji; EVA-00 goes berserk. In #16, the soul of EVA-01 makes contact with Shinji; EVA-01 goes berserk. In #25', the soul of EVA-02 makes contact with Asuka. And then?

[Mr. Tines]

Also, wounds suffered in an Eva had never before manifested themselves physically beyond depression of the skin, why only then? I mean, Asuka's real arms didn't fall off during the fight with Zeruel.

Asuka's synch ratio was already on the decline at that point; even so, she is given technical assistance before the decapitation

Misato: Asuka!
Cut all the neural connections. Hurry!

whereas during the UBF, with Mama there watching over her, I think she would have well beaten her previous lifetime best synch ratio by a wide margin, laying her open to more and deeper sympathetic hurt.

She took down... like... three with the Heavy Spear. (Cut one in half, got one through the shoulder, took the lower leg off another.) After to-be-spikehead jumped her, she abandoned it. Dunno why...

Possibly that was the point where sheer amok took over the last vestiges of considered thought, discarding tools and reverting to bare handed savagery.

[DarthMigit]

I'd imagine that they would be more effective as weapons in their Heavy Spear form.
Are you suggesting that the most powerful weapon in the eva universe was inferior to the heavy lances? I think not, did you see how unweildy those things were?

And I STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND! Even with her massive sync rate, Asuka's plug suit could not be affected by the assult on unit 02. It has no nerves and therefore, no neural connections.

[CanonRAP]

I'd imagine that they would be more effective as weapons in their Heavy Spear form.

Actually, I think the Heavy Spears were only there to do a cool 'sword fighting' scene (which they could've done in the series if Shogouki was designed with a sword earlier...), though using extendable-to-infinity spears to fights would make for a much more unique fight.

While you ponder a new theory consider this. How come some of Asuka's wounds were visible(peirced bleeding eye, split arm) and others were not (disembowelment). At first I thought that this could be explained by the plug suit "holding her together". However, this does not explain the split limb...

I think Asuka's synced with Kyoko that physical damage started to transfer over...or, it really is just 'visual creative license', as suggested in earlier threads.

And yeah, during the disembowelment, Asuna was cut off...she only re-synced with Kyoko after the Harpy Ravage.

But, to repeat;

What happens in episode #25' is W-E-I-R-D.

Since some of the stuff doesn't seem to conform to NGE rules.

[Reichu]

I think Asuka's synced with Kyoko that physical damage started to transfer over...or, it really is just 'visual creative license', as suggested in earlier threads.
Probably boils down to ATF Magic. Part of the Eva/Pilot connection is MPB-based, after all.

And yeah, during the disembowelment, Asuna was cut off...she only re-synced with Kyoko after the Harpy Ravage.
The pain still carried over, which is quite unusual -- it's sort of "synch, but not quite". Apparently, Mama didn't let go of her little girl's hand.

[felineki]

If you're going to do that, you need to throw some chairs around, too.Hmm, I wonder if Shinji was familar with Bobby Knight.

[neoXellos]

Then we have my friend's theory...Perhaps the entire eva series (not just the lance of Longinus) was just a dream in shinji's mind. Or perhaps the lance was just a tool created by shinji's desire to kill the angels?

[Reichu]

That's not much of a theory, considering he pulled it all out of his arse.

[CanonRAP]

It's the highly-anticipated/cheesy "it was all a dream"!

Or perhaps the lance was just a tool created by shinji's desire to kill the angels?

Shouldn't the Spear have shown up around, um, Ep3 then?

[neoXellos]

...i could take this and run in so many different directions...but im not...the spear was probably around in ep3 we just didnt see it

[Magami No ER]

Uh, the Spear's been around longer then that (at the time of episode three, the Antarctic),
When Adam reached the the planet, it was presumably her "Seed" weapon.

[Reichu]

The stuff in the CI makes one wonder exactly WHAT the hell Adam's Spear was/is supposed to be for...

"Are you intimating that my own Spear did me over? Is that it, Anno? What kind of LAME*** storytelling is that??? Wait... We don't know for sure that's what happened, because the passages in question are intentionally written to make no sense, both in and of themselves *and* within the context of the show? You meant that either I got screwed over by my Spear, or you're using the Spear(s) to screw over the fans? Maybe both? How's about you let me have a glorious battle to precede my really long nap or something? You know how much the nerds would pay to see that? THINK ABOUT THE MERCHANDISE YOU OLD FOOL!!!!"

Oh. Sorry. Rant.

[Magami No ER]

Hm, you're the only person who's ever managed to allow me to see Adam's POV in a tragic light. ;;P

[DarthMigit]

The stuff in the CI makes one wonder exactly WHAT the hell Adam's Spear was/is supposed to be for...

"Are you intimating that my own Spear did me over? Is that it, Anno? What kind of LAME*** storytelling is that??? Wait... We don't know for sure that's what happened, because the passages in question are intentionally written to make no sense, both in and of themselves *and* within the context of the show? You meant that either I got screwed over by my Spear, or you're using the Spear(s) to screw over the fans? Maybe both? How's about you let me have a glorious battle to precede my really long nap or something? You know how much the nerds would pay to see that? THINK ABOUT THE MERCHANDISE YOU OLD FOOL!!!!"

Oh. Sorry. Rant.

Huh, huh...you said spear...huh, huh.

You know what I think would be cool? A seed grudge match, each "God-like super being/entity" using a nasty angelic weapon to kick eachother's arses in a fight to determine the fate of all existance.

Adam armed with the indomitable lance of longinus and Lillith, presumably weilding some huge indestrucable cup... Possibly the "Grail of (insert suitable biblical G-word here).

Are you listening Anno as you and your vodoo practitioner demon writers formulate the brain-frying plot of the new animated epic that will undoubtably shatter fanon all across the net?

[Shin-seiki]

Huh, huh...you said spear...huh, huh.

You know what I think would be cool? A seed grudge match, each "God-like super being/entity" using a nasty angelic weapon to kick eachother's arses in a fight to determine the fate of all existance.Umm, yeah, that would be cool, wouldn't it? <_<
http://madboards.madman.com.au/viewtopic.php?p=559506#559506
http://madboards.madman.com.au/viewtopic.php?p=580022#580022

[DarthMigit]

Oh come on! Would nobody else love to see two of the most powerful forces in the universe duke it out? Of course it never actually happened within the Eva continuity. I'm not putting forward a theory here... but it would still be a hoot to see! I'm trying to inject a little fun here people! Don't take it so damn seriously! :P

[neoXellos]

hmmmmm...lillith versus his astranged (allegedly) first wife in a death match...sounds like a hell of a Pay Per View!

[Reichu]

hmmmmm...lillith versus his astranged (allegedly) first wife in a death match...sounds like a hell of a Pay Per View!
Uhhhhh.......

Umm, yeah, that would be cool, wouldn't it? <_<

Hells yeah dawg. (http://www.evacommentary.org/appendix/geektionary.html#duel)

[neoXellos]

er.....adam...sorry i get ahead of myself sometimes :p

[Reichu]

You DO know that Adam and Lilith are "Seeds of Life" sent by an alien civilization to spread humanity throughout the galaxy... right?

[Defiled one]

now, who was the alien civilization?...I bet 5 schoolgirls that they had tentacles!!!... comon its anime.. serioulsy the alien civilization...was god

[Reichu]

They are called "gods" by some.

http://www.evacommentary.org/misc-files/nge2ci_temp.txt

[DarthMigit]

Personally, I would rather not know all that much about the enigmatic seeds. They are the perfect mystery...

[Defiled one]

I wonder if the life was created by some alien who dumped trash on earth? IOI

[TS-Scorpio]

The whole thing is pretty much just another 2001: A Space Odessey influence.

[Defiled one]

Yeah.. to me.. evangelion was basicaly Adam. Lilith and Eve setling scores...and putting Shinji has their "stress reliver"

[Reichu]

Personally, I would rather not know all that much about the enigmatic seeds. They are the perfect mystery...
Not anymore.

[DarthMigit]

AAAAAAAAAH!!! My head!

Child of the Black moon. Take head...One who boasts of such knowlege as could not possibly be concieved by the Lilim, risks walking upon a path inevitably leading to great sorrow. The being you know as Adam, yet seeks revenge against the usurpers of the Earth, rightful domain of His own children.

The mystery of the seeds is more terrible and powerful than can possibly be imagined.

You claim to know...yet you do not even truly understand.

Woah...sorry, zoned out there...anyhow yeah you're probably right.

[Matsu'o Tsurayaba]

A thought,if the Lance is the same lance that pierced Jesus`s side,then why is it so large?Or is it another spear,that merly has the name of the spear that pierced Jesus?

[Ornette]

A thought,if the Lance is the same lance that pierced Jesus`s side,then why is it so large?Or is it another spear,that merly has the name of the spear that pierced Jesus?
It came from outer space and is alien. Unless it left Antarctica, transformed itself into a wooden spear, ended up in Golgatha where a roman soldier stabbed Jesus, then traveled back to Antarctica and stuck itself in Adam's back, it's not the same spear.

[Reichu]

AAAAAAAAAH!!! My head!
One of Adam's ovaries is in cold storage in my basement.

[DarthMigit]

One of Adam's ovaries is in cold storage in my basement.

Heh, heh... sorry I just couldn't resist! I am glad somebody finally got my little joke there. :P

[sidthebeast]

Ok, I realize it's been a few years since this thread has been discussed but being as how I'm new here and would like to answer this question: What is the lance of longinus and what is it's origin? I can ALMOST fully tell you exactly what it is. I might have a forgotten a detail or two, but I assure you that this is the absolute truth. The lance has NOTHING I repeat NOTHING to do with piercing the side of Jesus. The religious symbolism as some ppl on here mentioned was made just for the sake of looking cool and keeping us busy and confused, trying to figure things out. It has no direct meaning except vaguely. The lance of longinus was sent by The First Ancestral Race along with each Seed of Life sent. So Adam and Lillith, being Seeds of Life, were both given lances of longinus and were ALSO each given Dead Sea Scrolls. Both of them landed on earth approx 4 billion years ago (Adam first, and then Lillith which became known as first impact). The lance's true purpose is that it was designed to "turn off" each seed a la keeping it dormant. So while Adam was kept asleep in a dormant state for all these years, Lillith was active and gave life to the humans. THEN we caused Second Impact by contacting Adam and consequently him giving rise to the Angels. Does this make sense? How do I know all this? I've been exposed to the truth, enlighten yourselves http://www.youtube.com/user/ReVolutionOfEva :)

[Tom Servo]

The lance's true purpose is that it was designed to "turn off" each seed a la keeping it dormant. So while Adam was kept asleep in a dormant state for all these years, Lillith was active and gave life to the humans. THEN we caused Second Impact by contacting Adam and consequently him giving rise to the Angels. Does this make sense?
It doesn't make sense.

As far as I can think of the lance is used in four different ways:

It's used to pierce the core of Adam/Lilith and restrains them.
It's used to pierce the core of EVA-01, which transforms it into an ark.
It's used to pierce the core of Arael, destroying it.
It's used prior to Second Impact (presumably piercing the core of Adam).
The Eva series also use theirs to mark EVA-01 with the stigmata, but I dunno whether that should be admitted with the other instances of its use.

In order to say what the lance does you need one explanation that covers all four of those points, just saying that it keeps Adam in a dormant state doesn't help explain its use elsewhere in the series.

[KatayokuのTenshi]

The religious symbolism as some ppl on here mentioned was made just for the sake of looking cool and keeping us busy and confused, trying to figure things out. It has no direct meaning except vaguely.

Seele was responsible for coming up with the names. *shrug*

In order to say what the lance does you need one explanation that covers all four of those points, just saying that it keeps Adam in a dormant state doesn't help explain its use elsewhere in the series.

It's a safety device.... it must be a Swiss Army Spear. It has multiple different functions and handy attachments. It even has a little tool for getting stones out of horse's hooves.

...of course it could just be that it was meant to disable things like Adam/Lilith and Arael was just to weak to handle it. The other stuff was just a side affect under unusual circumstances.

It's used prior to Second Impact (presumably piercing the core of Adam).


Of course it could just be a tool for manipulating the Progenitor Entiies. An alien Allen key. They put it in on it's own to disable them and they can add things to it (Like DNA) to change how they act. For example to make them Tang the world.

...A tuning fork.

[Count A'ight]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v415/DWJohnson/thisthreadwontdie.jpg

[sidthebeast]

It doesn't make sense.

As far as I can think of the lance is used in four different ways:

It's used to pierce the core of Adam/Lilith and restrains them.
It's used to pierce the core of EVA-01, which transforms it into an ark.
It's used to pierce the core of Arael, destroying it.
It's used prior to Second Impact (presumably piercing the core of Adam).
The Eva series also use theirs to mark EVA-01 with the stigmata, but I dunno whether that should be admitted with the other instances of its use.
This actually doesn't make any sense to me.

In order to say what the lance does you need one explanation that covers all four of those points, just saying that it keeps Adam in a dormant state doesn't help explain its use elsewhere in the series.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVBTV5kCc5Y
Watch this and then go back and watch the series again. It makes TOTAL sense.

[Tom Servo]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVBTV5kCc5Y
Watch this and then go back and watch the series again. It makes TOTAL sense.
You'll have to explain to me how that video addresses any of the points raised.

The other thing with the video is around the middle of it he says that our first ancestors sowed their seeds across the galaxy and that there are other planets which have been seeded. This doesn't make sense given:

The distance between stars is simply too large. The closest star to earth is around 24 trillion miles away.
The white and black moons couldn't have been travelling anywhere close to the speed of light on their arrival to our solar system, otherwise their impact with the earth would have caused more damage than it did. That the moons were travelling so slowly makes them arriving from another star less feasible.
We know the impacts occurred around 4 billion years ago because one of them caused the formation of the moon, the earth isn't much older than 4 billion years old. Our first ancestors, who created the white and black moons, would have had to flung the moons precisely at our solar system from trillions of miles away to intercept the earth which hadn't even formed yet and... it all sounds really unlikely.
It makes more sense that the white and black moons were sent out as lifeboats from a threatened planet within our own solar system.

[sidthebeast]

You'll have to explain to me how that video addresses any of the points raised.

The other thing with the video is around the middle of it he says that our first ancestors sowed their seeds across the galaxy and that there are other planets which have been seeded. This doesn't make sense given:

The distance between stars is simply too large. The closest star to earth is around 24 trillion miles away.
The white and black moons couldn't have been travelling anywhere close to the speed of light on their arrival to our solar system, otherwise their impact with the earth would have caused more damage than it did. That the moons were travelling so slowly makes them arriving from another star less feasible.
We know the impacts occurred around 4 billion years ago because one of them caused the formation of the moon, the earth isn't much older than 4 billion years old. Our first ancestors, who created the white and black moons, would have had to flung the moons precisely at our solar system from trillions of miles away to intercept the earth which hadn't even formed yet and... it all sounds really unlikely.
It makes more sense that the white and black moons were sent out as lifeboats from a threatened planet within our own solar system.

Distance between the stars being too great just isn't a feasible answer huh? Or maybe you're forgetting that this is ANIME, where things don't have to obey laws of physics or any kind of physical realism. Geez it makes me sad to actually hear a fan defending their case with feasible science...isn't this a japanese cartoon we're talking about? Maybe you wanna tell me that all the biblical imagery/symbolism in Evangelion is obviously not actually connected to the Bible in the sense that it's true, but wait, of course it's not it's anime!

[Tom Servo]

Distance between the stars being too great just isn't a feasible answer huh? Or maybe you're forgetting that this is ANIME, where things don't have to obey laws of physics or any kind of physical realism.
True, I don't expect Misato's boobs to obey any of the laws of physics but it's a sci-fi show so these sorts of things get me all nerded up.

[Count A'ight]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVBTV5kCc5Y
Watch this and then go back and watch the series again. It makes TOTAL sense.

It's just one windbag fan presenting some common fanwankery as fact. Pay it no mind.

[sidthebeast]

It's just one windbag fan presenting some common fanwankery as fact. Pay it no mind.

I'm gonna have to object to that comment, I don't believe this is just some fanwankery some obsessed fan is presenting. If you actually watch all the videos and then go back and watch the show, it makes a lot of sense! No offense or anything but I really think at least 90% of what he says is true, and it seems he's done his homework on researching the very outline, which explains everything he says, of the show.

[Tom Servo]

I'm gonna have to object to that comment, I don't believe this is just some fanwankery some obsessed fan is presenting.
He used to post on EGF before he was banned from it and got the lance/moon stuff from a licensed video game (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neon_Genesis_Evangelion_2), a translation of which has been floating around since 2006.

[Foppish Dandy]

The real question is how big Longinius must've been.

He must've been built like a 20 foot tall brick shithouse to lift that thing and stab Jesus.

And it seems rather mean to stab Jesus with such a big spear to be honest; unless he was huge too. Wait, does this mean that all the people in the bible were giants? Oh dear me, I'm all discombobulated.

And don't throw that poppycock of it not having anything to do with jesus. If it isn't the Lance of Longinus then they wouldn't have called it the Lance of Longinus, they would've called the Big Twirly Angel Stabbing Spear.

NGE is a series known for it's straightforward, no-nonsense plot after all.

[A. van Veen]

I'm gonna have to object to that comment, I don't believe this is just some fanwankery some obsessed fan is presenting. If you actually watch all the videos and then go back and watch the show, it makes a lot of sense! No offense or anything but I really think at least 90% of what he says is true, and it seems he's done his homework on researching the very outline, which explains everything he says, of the show.

I saw the video trying to "explain" the appearance of Rei in ep 1, and it took the video creator some 5-6 minutes to come up with the reason that it's because Rei is a living god. Why did it take 5-6 minutes? Because he unnecessarily padded it out (e.g., comparing Rei to some comic book character) to try and make it sound like it was a really difficult concept to grasp when it's plain obvious that Rei has divine qualities from the anime. I could have explained that just as well in 20 seconds or less.

If the rest of the videos are anything like this one, then my advice is simply to learn to differentiate what is fanwankery and what is good research.

[The Sorrel]

And don't throw that poppycock of it not having anything to do with jesus. If it isn't the Lance of Longinus then they wouldn't have called it the Lance of Longinus, they would've called the Big Twirly Angel Stabbing Spear.

Yes you are right.
And the Lilith hanging in Terminal Dogma is of course the Lilith mentioned in the Bible, like the Angels that are trying to kill the entire human race.

And the Computer System used in by NERV are also the Magi from the Bible.

Its not like people just name something after Objects or Characters appearing in the Bible or something like that. This never happened and will never happen, who would have such idears in the first place?

:facepalm:

[Count A'ight]

Wait, does this mean that all the people in the bible were giants?

According to Kent Hovind, yes, they were.

And for those of you who don't know, Kent Hovind is a crack monkey whose worldview more closely resembles the Evangelion universe than the one that we actually live in.

[Foppish Dandy]

Its not like people just name something after Objects or Characters appearing in the Bible or something like that. This never happened and will never happen, who would have such idears in the first place?



I know, rite?

Also, it's "Ideas", boss.

[The Sorrel]

Also, it's "Ideas", boss.

Who cares, I'm German xD

[Tom Servo]

I saw the video trying to "explain" the appearance of Rei in ep 1, and it took the video creator some 5-6 minutes to come up with the reason that it's because Rei is a living god. Why did it take 5-6 minutes? Because he unnecessarily padded it out (e.g., comparing Rei to some comic book character) to try and make it sound like it was a really difficult concept to grasp when it's plain obvious that Rei has divine qualities from the anime. I could have explained that just as well in 20 seconds or less.
There's nothing divine or magical going on.

It's worth noting that Rei appears to everyone during End of Evangelion, Shinji can't let himself go and has to be bullied across the abyss where he promptly ****s everything up.

And don't throw that poppycock of it not having anything to do with jesus. If it isn't the Lance of Longinus then they wouldn't have called it the Lance of Longinus, they would've called the Big Twirly Angel Stabbing Spear.
Do you have problems getting past the names of other military/scientific hardware and projects as well? Atlas rockets, poseidon missiles, the gemini program...

[Foppish Dandy]

Do you have problems getting past the names of other military/scientific hardware and projects as well? Atlas rockets, poseidon missiles, the gemini program...

Yes. Obviously the poseidon missiles are the turds of poseidon (which are known to have explosive properties), the gemini program is about raising twins to become pilots and Atlas rockets are made by that charming rouge, Frank Fontaine and sold at a high price.

I thought everybody know about these things :|